Unknown regiments BAOC

[mooke07]

Hi all,

I have not been able to identify the two pals of my late father, Royal Lincolnshire regiment (centre) taken in Germany with British Army Occupation of the Rhine in 1948 - the chap on the right has a lot going on on his shoulder and cannot make out regimental title or cap badge with certainty. Chap on the left wears a blackened badge - uncertain here as well.

Any suggestions much appreciated, regards Dean.

[fougasse1940]

Chap on the right, REME?

Rgds,
Thomas.

[54Bty]

A larger picture with more pixels would help, most of what is on the shoulder of the right hand man (as viewing) is the centre mans hand. However the badge could be an Irish Harp!

Marc

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by 54Bty

A larger picture with more pixels would help, most of what is on the shoulder of the right hand man (as viewing) is the centre mans hand. However the badge could be an Irish Harp!

Marc

Yes, I agree. It might be the North Irish Brigade, who were formed in July 1948, and it appears he might be a Fusilier (Royal Irish or Royal Inniskilling), as he is wearing white on red shoulder titles.

I think the photo is later than 1948, as in that year the two regular battalions of the Royal Lincs (1st and 2nd) amalgamated at El Ballah in Egypt on the 28th October and remained in that country until May 1952 when, after a 2 month stay in Loughborough (UK) they moved to Germany, briefly transiting through Mons Barracks, Iserlohn, in the summer of 1952 and then to Manchester Barracks, Goslar (part of 91 Lorried Infantry Brigade) in July, where they remained until moving to Berlin (Brooke Barracks) in 1954.

The commanding officer was Lt Col [later - Sir] Christopher Earle Welby-Everard, who commanded the 2nd battalion on D-Day (he was wounded in Normandy) and then took over the 1st battalion as part of the amalgamation.

91 Lorried Infantry Brigade (HQ Hilden) was part of 11th Armd Div (HQ Herford) and comprised 3 battalions: 1 Royal Lincs, 1 Sherwood Foresters and 1 Royal Irish Fusiliers.

The other Bde in the Division was 33 Armd Bde, one of whose infantry battalions was 1 Kings Royal Rifle Corps (Sennelager), who at that time were still wearing a blackened badge, although the shape of the badge in your photo is not right for that regiment.

[mooke07]

Thanks all,

I will take the picture to work and scan it on a better quality scanner as like you I lose resolution on blowing it up at present. Will re-post it then.

Dad came back from Germany in August 1948 so that is latest date the picture could be. He was not attached to a Lincs battalion as he had tonsilitis when supposed to be posted so he went from General Service Corps to Germany attached to a signals unit and did policing duties.

Thanks for trying, much appreciated, cheers Dean.

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by mooke07

Thanks all,

I will take the picture to work and scan it on a better quality scanner as like you I lose resolution on blowing it up at present. Will re-post it then.

Dad came back from Germany in August 1948 so that is latest date the picture could be. He was not attached to a Lincs battalion as he had tonsilitis when supposed to be posted so he went from General Service Corps to Germany attached to a signals unit and did policing duties.

Thanks for trying, much appreciated, cheers Dean.

I should have known that you would be positive and accurate about the year and it did not occur to me that he might not be serving with his battalion. The kind of appointment he was filling is designated E2, meaning extra-regimentally employed. E2 posts exist in every garrison and help to form the infrastructure within which the deployable units exist. They ensure that when the units deploy there is still a structure left behind and everything doesn't just collapse.

Do you know what signal unit he served with (probably a Bde or Div HQ unit), or even the location where he was will help?

[mooke07]

Thanks again Toby,

Dad was stationed in Gluckstadt for most of his service and yes the E2 fits. I only know it was a signals unit and seemed he mounted guard a lot!

cheers Dean

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by mooke07

Thanks again Toby,

Dad was stationed in Gluckstadt for most of his service and yes the E2 fits. I only know it was a signals unit and seemed he mounted guard a lot!

cheers Dean

Specialists from highly trained signals units could not afford to be misemployed so the necessary RP function was found by utilising men in E2 appointments from other cap badges (units). Your father was attached to a Signals Intelligence (Sigint) unit that specialised in intercepting enemy, or potential enemy wireless transmissions, in order to learn what they were doing, or planning to do. The units name was No 1 Wireless Regiment.

In August 1946, whilst commanded by Lt. Col A E Barton, the then No 1 "Special" Wireless Regiment moved to Peterborough Barracks Glückstadt (see enclosed photos) near Hamburg, a town in Schleswig-Holstein, situated on the right bank of the river Elbe. Formerly it was a shore accommodation base for German U-Boot crews, providing rest and recreation facilities for the survivors of the Battle of the Atlantic. (At the outbreak of the second world war it was known as U Boat Training facility Number 14).

The Regiment was renamed No.1 Wireless Regiment in 1947, whilst under the command of Lt Col F S Pipe-Wolferstan. Signals Intelligence intensity increased significantly when in June 1948, the Soviet Union blockaded all surface transport into West Berlin. The West responded by flying coal, food, and medicine to the city by military aircraft, an air-lift that lasted for over a year and which kept the city alive.

During the period of the Cold war, regimental manpower came predominately from the Royal Corps of Signals, the Intelligence Corps and the WRAC. These formed the main operational component. The former having responsiblity for intercept collection and the latter two for intelligence analysis and reporting. Other elements consisted of personnel from the Royal Pioneer Corps, Royal Army Pay Corps, R.E.M.E, Army Catering Corps, Royal Army Medical Corps, Royal Army Ordnance Corps and others. All played an equally important part in the administration and logistical support of the Regiment.

The Regiment had three home based Squadrons, 1, 2 and HQ.

1 Squadron, was made up of all operating personnel. This was divided into a four way 24hr Troop intercept system; 151, 152, 153, and 154 Troops. Each Troop was commanded by a Sgt/Supervisor Radio. The operational intercept commander was usually a specialist Sigint officer, known originally as the Setroom Officer (SETRO) and later the Military Operations Officer (MOO). He was responsible for all operational manning, equipment and personnel. The Squadron also manned the HF DF Control, which controlled the remote HF DF network covering both north and south Germany; using Morse and a One Time Cipher Pad (OTP)for tasking and frequency steerage. The local DF site was located in the nearby village of Effeld. It also had remote detached HF DF sensors as well as other elements at Aügsberg, Wesendorf, Degerndorf, Dannenberg, Bad Aibling, Herzo Base, Effeld, Räbke and Wüsterheide near Cuxhaven.

TM Troop, which was commanded by a Technical Officer Telecommunicatios (TOT), was responsible for the procurement care and maintenance of all operational equipment

2 Squadron, consisted of Intelligence Corps and WRAC personnel to analyse and interpret intercepted data.

HQ Squadron provided the traditional administration and logistical support as well as a Military Training element.

At various times, the Regiment also had attached personnel seconded from the Canadian Intelligence Corps, Royal Canadian Corps of Signals, and the Royal Australian Corps of Signals, as well as elements from other agencies.

1 Wireless Regiment remained in Glückstadt until February 1950 when it transferred to Nelson Barracks Münster (named after Major David Nelson VC), commanded by Lt Col R G Yolland OBE.

Glückstadt is abour 62km NW from Hamburg. It is about 23km from Itzehoe, 27km from Uetersen, and 32km from Brunsbüttel, all of which are locations used by British units around the end of WW2.

After the fall of Hamburg, the 7th Armoured Division moved northwards through Schleswig-Holstein reaching the gates of the City of Gluckstadt. The first unit to occupy the barracks was 1 RTR, which departed in July 1945.

Regimental Policemen (part of HQ Sqn) traditionally occupied the Guardroom from 6 in the morning until 6 at night when they handed over to the night guard found as a routine from troops occupying the barracks. At weekends the routine changed and the troops mounted a 24hr guard (one on Saturday and one on Sunday), but were usually accompanied by a single ("Duty") RP who would be responsible for any prisoners in the cells and any troubles that might take place in the NAAFI. He would be assisted by duty NCOs ("Canteen Orderly Cpls"), usually one from each of the sub-units (squadrons on the base).

The Regiment was redesignated 13th Signal Regiment (Radio) on 1 September 1959 and continued its role until 1995, when after a period of 40 years of distinguished intercept history, 13 Signal Regiment (Radio) disbanded on the 60th anniversary of the formation of its antecedent, No 4 Wireless Company, in 1934.

[mooke07]

Wow Toby - thank you very much for the detailed and highly informative reply. You have addressed so many issues. I wish I had discussed more with my late father of his service. A common lament I am sure.

It all follows and you have painted a very easy image of service in Germany at that time.

Dad found tea chests of Nazi regalia when they supervised the cleaning out of the barracks loft that you have described. Known of it I am pleased to say they kept. One whole chest were SS dress daggers and all were destroyed.

Thanks again I feel very privileged to have had so much information provided.

Dean.

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by mooke07

Dad found tea chests of Nazi regalia when they supervised the cleaning out of the barracks loft that you have described. Known of it I am pleased to say they kept. One whole chest were SS dress daggers and all were destroyed.

Dean.

It's my pleasure Dean. With regards to the Nazi connection you might find the following information of interest:

[mooke07]

Most enjoyable read - thanks again Toby rounds out the information gathering very nicely.

Cheers Dean.