Portrait of Loyals Territorial Officer.

[Peter Brydon]

Interesting photo on famous auction website showing Territorial “T” being worn above the collar badge, can’t remember seeing them being worn in that position before.

P.

[leigh kitchen]

I've never seen that positioning of the "T" before in a photograph.
There wouldn't be room fit it under the badge - any chance this officer is a regular who's now TF and has managed to wear this arrangement rather than reposition the collar badge or purchase a new tunic?
I would imagine the higher his rank the more likely the badge arrangement being tolerated?

[Peter Brydon]

Leigh, I seem to recall Ray Westlake in a book or article on Territorial shoulder titles saying Territorial other ranks didn’t like being identified as such and so removed the top “T” from their titles, not sure how officers would have felt, but I would assume they would have been happy to be identified as Territorials. Notwithstanding all that, I have never seen a picture with the “T” in that position either.

Peter

[grey_green_acorn]

Is it the case that the Ts under collar badges were initially worn at the point of the longer collar of the closed collar Service Dress tunic. When the open collar tunic (worn with collar and tie) was introduced the stepped collar style left even less space for the T to sit below the larger regimental collar badges?

Tim

[Peter Brydon]

Tim, it was was certainly a squeeze with the closed collar.

Peter

[leigh kitchen]

Originally Posted by Peter Brydon

Leigh, I seem to recall Ray Westlake in a book or article on Territorial shoulder titles saying Territorial other ranks didn’t like being identified as such and so removed the top “T” from their titles, not sure how officers would have felt, but I would assume they would have been happy to be identified as Territorials. Notwithstanding all that, I have never seen a picture with the “T” in that position either.

Peter

I'm thinking of the practicality of continuing usage of a regulars tunic without having to reposition the collar badges to facilitate the "T"s below and thereby leaving exposed holes in the fabric - I hadn't heard that bit of info re the "T"s being removed, that's interesting - given the community spirit and accompanying esprit de coeur of TF units of the time Id've thought the TF men wouldn't feel that there was a "stigma" attached - perhaps that was more of a Kitchener Volunteer and conscript attitude as the war progressed and personnel were posted hitherr and thither?