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  #16  
Old 28-09-16, 08:39 AM
arrestingu arrestingu is offline
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Interesting RNAS , solid form 1914 wing / Brest eagle. probably private purchase / canadian made.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMAG1344_1.jpg (24.3 KB, 20 views)
File Type: jpg IMAG1345_1.jpg (20.8 KB, 18 views)

Last edited by arrestingu; 22-07-17 at 06:33 PM.
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  #17  
Old 28-09-16, 08:40 AM
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....some of my collection.
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File Type: jpg IMAG1237_BURST002_1.jpg (63.0 KB, 59 views)
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  #18  
Old 28-09-16, 08:43 AM
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Hope the above info is of use. Eagles recalled is a valuable reference book. The above dates on my eagles are what I believe are correct , from my own research and from the individual pilots known service. It is certainly plausible that WW1 two bolt variety eagles were utilized during the post war period.
best wishes to all steve.

Last edited by arrestingu; 28-09-16 at 10:02 AM.
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  #19  
Old 28-09-16, 09:48 AM
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Wonderful to have all these examples, info and dates in one place. I'll be studying them carefully.
Many thanks.
Wayne
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  #20  
Old 07-10-16, 07:10 PM
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Default RNAS / RAF Items.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arrestingu View Post
This man served in the RNAS and RAF, both eagles are solid form ,three bolt varieties...the RAF 1918 retains original part of tunic.

Hello all,
I've recently "rediscovered" a RNAS / RAF lot I won the bid for on eBay quite a while back.
The lot consisted of buttons,badges and bullion insignia,both RNAS & RAF.
I'd appreciate some advice regarding which items relate to which service,as I always believed the 3 screw post eagle badges were RNAS.
Cheers.
Alan
Attached Images
File Type: jpg RNAS EAGLES 1.jpg (75.0 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS EAGLES 2.jpg (57.8 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS EAGLE 3.jpg (37.2 KB, 11 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS EAGLE 4.jpg (31.6 KB, 12 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS EAGLE 5.jpg (42.0 KB, 11 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS EAGLE 6.jpg (27.5 KB, 7 views)
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  #21  
Old 07-10-16, 07:21 PM
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Here's the rest of the items in the collection,which seems to indicate the original owner could have been a RNAS pilot, and was then absorbed into the newly founded RAF.
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File Type: jpg RNAS GP 2.jpg (117.8 KB, 19 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS GP 1.jpg (86.9 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpg RAF CROWNS 1.jpg (87.9 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg RAF CROWNS 2.jpg (44.7 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS BTNS 1.jpg (55.8 KB, 23 views)
File Type: jpg RNAS BTNS 2.jpg (70.4 KB, 10 views)
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  #22  
Old 07-10-16, 07:28 PM
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Here are the RAF related items.
The buttons seem to be contemporary to the late / post WW1 era,but
I know nothing about bullion and cloth badges,so I can't give an informed opinion.

Cheers.
Alan
Attached Images
File Type: jpg RAF BTNS 1.jpg (51.6 KB, 18 views)
File Type: jpg RAF BTNS 2.jpg (60.4 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg RAF WINGS 1.jpg (55.1 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpg RAF WINGS 2.jpg (97.1 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg RAF WINGS 3.jpg (53.1 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg RAF DR 1.jpg (97.2 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpg RAF DR 2.jpg (107.7 KB, 4 views)
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  #23  
Old 07-10-16, 08:19 PM
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Pilot wings are RAF 1918. worn on the khaki or new short lived pale Russian blue tunic .
Buttons are RAF 1918 first issue with wreath, then later issue without.
Cuff eagle I believe are just two patterns of RAF 1918 cuff eagles.
The Naval swirl/ rank insignia I certainly believe he was naval before RAF.
The cap badge , looks medical , even american..no idea ??
hope that helps ...yet again just my humble opinion , right or wrong.
steve.
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  #24  
Old 07-10-16, 09:54 PM
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Steve,
Thanks for your observations ,it's much appreciated.
The first lot of buttons with the roped edges are more likely RNAS issue.
It was the eagle badges and the age of the bullion items I was more unsure of.

Unfortunately there are so many fake bullion badges being produced lately that it does make you question anything bought in the past.
However,I'm glad to hear the wings and medical badge do appear to be authentic badges.
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  #25  
Old 07-10-16, 11:13 PM
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yes the RNAS, issue buttons were same but bronzed, the RAF copied them.
The wing is 100% WW1 genuine.
cheers
Steve
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  #26  
Old 22-07-17, 02:23 PM
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Default another 3 post eagle

Here's another 3 post eagle I recently picked up. Die cast in a single piece. It weighs in at 5.3 gm, width about 2 1/8"
Do the 3 posts, de facto, define it as RNAS? Thoughts Steve?
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File Type: jpg RNAS eagle 3 post die cast single piece sm.jpg (57.9 KB, 17 views)
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  #27  
Old 22-07-17, 06:28 PM
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Defo WW1 ,they were also used by RAF 1918, the eagle early ones tend to be more detailed and more 3D...very hard to be 100% even when sourced with other items.
The 100% RNAS first pattern are 3D two part usually air vented. The look like the eagles produced by FIX in france .
cheers
Steve
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  #28  
Old 20-07-19, 12:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorgon View Post
It is quite often notoriously difficult to identify the period and use of metal eagles used on Commonwealth Naval and Air Force uniforms.
As I understand it, one of the generally accepted determinants of RNAS eagles is that they initially incorporated three posts or more accurately, a WWI era eagle with three posts was used by the RNAS. They can be found in pickled brass, or gold gilt and cast from various brass/bronze alloys. Many were manufactured in two, carefully soldered pieces. The back plate frequently had two small vent holes which released the gas formed during heating and soldering. They were manufactured between 1913 and 1918 for the RNAS and all the examples below measure 54mm in width, plus or minus 1mm. One general observation Iíve noticed is they all have a more slender and elegant wing compared to later issued wings such as the WWI RAF versions.
Initially, the eagle faced right (from the viewers perspective) as they were worn on the left sleeve (and the eagle was always supposed to be looking ďbehindĒ). In June of 1917, regulations approved the eagles to be worn on both sleeves and thus the left handed eagle was introduced.
Below are examples of what I think meet the requirements for RNAS eagles but Iím open to discussion by those who are more knowledgeable and experienced in this area of collecting, particularly for the last item.
The first composite image illustrates a RNAS sleeve eagle which is described by Warren Carroll as being for the blue uniform. It has the backing plate, three posts and one remaining notched, circular nut. The 2nd picture is similar in design but cast in one piece and has interesting knurled nuts. Perhaps the nuts can reveal something about the date or manufacturer? The 3rd item is a pin conversion of a variation of the three post, single die cast eagle made sometime after 1914. It is not uncommon to find these conversions for those who served overseas and, according to Carroll (p. 41, Eagles Recalled), worn above the left pocket on the khaki uniforms. In the last example, it perhaps requires a little more imagination to be convinced the 3rd post was present before the pin was added. However, there is a slightly raised surface and grind marks in the tail feather area that suggest this is the case. I suspect this pin went onto to a third incarnation as there is a tiny loop on one win tip which could have facilitated its use on a charm or sweetheart. One often finds sweetheart eagles with pin backs making it very difficult, if not impossible, to determine if the given eagle was initially used by a serviceman or made for and given to a loved one, especially I think with RAF and interwar examples.
I would welcome any corrections and expansions by Forum members on any of the above. I recognize this has been discussed in the past and I for one, could use a refresher.
I have a left facing eagle, die struck, two loops for a cotter pin. I am trying to ID it as to ww1 or ww2 and RNAS or RAF. Everything in Warren Carroll's book is all screw posts and pin backs. Anyone help me to identify it and date it. Did they make Eagles sleeve badges with loops and a cotter pin?
Any help would be appreciated.
Badger
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  #29  
Old 20-07-19, 12:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorgon View Post
It is quite often notoriously difficult to identify the period and use of metal eagles used on Commonwealth Naval and Air Force uniforms.
As I understand it, one of the generally accepted determinants of RNAS eagles is that they initially incorporated three posts or more accurately, a WWI era eagle with three posts was used by the RNAS. They can be found in pickled brass, or gold gilt and cast from various brass/bronze alloys. Many were manufactured in two, carefully soldered pieces. The back plate frequently had two small vent holes which released the gas formed during heating and soldering. They were manufactured between 1913 and 1918 for the RNAS and all the examples below measure 54mm in width, plus or minus 1mm. One general observation Iíve noticed is they all have a more slender and elegant wing compared to later issued wings such as the WWI RAF versions.
Initially, the eagle faced right (from the viewers perspective) as they were worn on the left sleeve (and the eagle was always supposed to be looking ďbehindĒ). In June of 1917, regulations approved the eagles to be worn on both sleeves and thus the left handed eagle was introduced.
Below are examples of what I think meet the requirements for RNAS eagles but Iím open to discussion by those who are more knowledgeable and experienced in this area of collecting, particularly for the last item.
The first composite image illustrates a RNAS sleeve eagle which is described by Warren Carroll as being for the blue uniform. It has the backing plate, three posts and one remaining notched, circular nut. The 2nd picture is similar in design but cast in one piece and has interesting knurled nuts. Perhaps the nuts can reveal something about the date or manufacturer? The 3rd item is a pin conversion of a variation of the three post, single die cast eagle made sometime after 1914. It is not uncommon to find these conversions for those who served overseas and, according to Carroll (p. 41, Eagles Recalled), worn above the left pocket on the khaki uniforms. In the last example, it perhaps requires a little more imagination to be convinced the 3rd post was present before the pin was added. However, there is a slightly raised surface and grind marks in the tail feather area that suggest this is the case. I suspect this pin went onto to a third incarnation as there is a tiny loop on one win tip which could have facilitated its use on a charm or sweetheart. One often finds sweetheart eagles with pin backs making it very difficult, if not impossible, to determine if the given eagle was initially used by a serviceman or made for and given to a loved one, especially I think with RAF and interwar examples.
I would welcome any corrections and expansions by Forum members on any of the above. I recognize this has been discussed in the past and I for one, could use a refresher.
I have a left facing eagle, die struck, two loops for a cotter pin. I am trying to ID it as to ww1 or ww2 and RNAS or RAF. Everything in Warren Carroll's book is all screw posts and pin backs. Anyone help me to identify it and date it. Did they make Eagles sleeve badges with loops and a cotter pin?
Any help would be appreciated.
Badge
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  #30  
Old 20-07-19, 12:55 AM
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Unhappy Eagles

I may be repeating myself as I am new at this. I have a left facing, die cast eagle with lugs that I am trying to identify. Is it ww1 or ww2, is it a sleeve eagle, RNAS or RAF? Everything in Warren Carroll's book is screw posts , wires or prongs. I am not sure what prongs are.? Any help would be appreciated.


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