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  #1  
Old 21-03-21, 11:23 PM
Stma Stma is offline
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Default Connaught Rangers Cap Badge WW1 - genuine or fake?

Dear all,

I was wondering whether anyone could possibly provide some advice as to whether this Connaught Rangers cap badge is genuine or a copy? Apologies for writing a lengthy message, but this badge seems to borderline as to its authenticity to me.

Please note that in some of the photos, I have placed the badge in question (with voided strings) next to a reproduction (without voided strings and an incorrect back) to perhaps give a better perspective on the badge in question.

The things which make me believe that the badge with voided strings in question is perhaps genuine are:

1) That we have voided strings, which is one of the signs of a genuine badge

2) The mottled effect on the scroll with: Connaught Rangers has subtle / light dotting, as opposed to heavy dotting, which can be seen on the repro badge

3) The back reverse image of the badge is crisp as opposed to feint

4) The slider appears to be of the correct length / very slightly tapered and is fairly thick metal with feint signs of a crimp mark. In addition, the brazing which joins the slider to the badge appears to be of brass as opposed to copper.

As far as I am aware and unless I am mistaken these are the signs of a genuine badge.

However, my reasons for the badge in question being a fake would be as follows:

1) There is no ‘U’ shaped strengthening wire brazed to the back, which attaches the crown to the harp on the rear. However, I have been told that not all Connaught Rangers badges had this strengthening wire to the back of them – is this true or false?

2) The badge does not appear to be ‘well used’, although not necessarily a guarantee of authenticity, I have been informed that original badges often have a natural aged / patinated look

Any advice / guidance on whether the badge in question is genuine / reproduction would be much appreciated.

Many thanks for your assistance.

Regards.
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  #2  
Old 21-03-21, 11:36 PM
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Luke H Luke H is offline
 
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Yes it’s genuine.

It is true that not all Connaught Rangers had strengthening wire.

The badge looks in very nice condition to me, all down to how it’s been stored in the 99+ years, in this case clearly favourable dry conditions.
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  #3  
Old 22-03-21, 06:23 AM
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  #4  
Old 22-03-21, 07:29 AM
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From the photographs, I would have thought that your badge is an Edwardian example and rather scarce, very similar to the Victorian made pieces in terms of the manufacture and material used, you would not normally expect to see any wire on either of those two badges, very nice indeed.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Stma View Post
Dear all,

I was wondering whether anyone could possibly provide some advice as to whether this Connaught Rangers cap badge is genuine or a copy? Apologies for writing a lengthy message, but this badge seems to borderline as to its authenticity to me.

Please note that in some of the photos, I have placed the badge in question (with voided strings) next to a reproduction (without voided strings and an incorrect back) to perhaps give a better perspective on the badge in question.

The things which make me believe that the badge with voided strings in question is perhaps genuine are:

1) That we have voided strings, which is one of the signs of a genuine badge

2) The mottled effect on the scroll with: Connaught Rangers has subtle / light dotting, as opposed to heavy dotting, which can be seen on the repro badge

3) The back reverse image of the badge is crisp as opposed to feint

4) The slider appears to be of the correct length / very slightly tapered and is fairly thick metal with feint signs of a crimp mark. In addition, the brazing which joins the slider to the badge appears to be of brass as opposed to copper.

As far as I am aware and unless I am mistaken these are the signs of a genuine badge.

However, my reasons for the badge in question being a fake would be as follows:

1) There is no ‘U’ shaped strengthening wire brazed to the back, which attaches the crown to the harp on the rear. However, I have been told that not all Connaught Rangers badges had this strengthening wire to the back of them – is this true or false?

2) The badge does not appear to be ‘well used’, although not necessarily a guarantee of authenticity, I have been informed that original badges often have a natural aged / patinated look

Any advice / guidance on whether the badge in question is genuine / reproduction would be much appreciated.

Many thanks for your assistance.

Regards.
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  #5  
Old 22-03-21, 04:17 PM
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Luke H Luke H is offline
 
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Personally I wouldn’t put that particular badge down as Edwardian, whilst the slider is long I do not believe it’s a 1903-06 ‘long’ slider. Re the badge itself the quality is not quite there IMO for it to be that period in terms of the detail especially on the harp and quality of strike particularly on the scroll’s reverse.

I’ve attached a couple of pics of mine which are Edwardian in my belief.

As you can see on this particular looped version the strengtheners are already being used.
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  #6  
Old 22-03-21, 09:00 PM
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That's a lovely 'long slider' Luke, thanks for sharing. Regards Mark
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  #7  
Old 22-03-21, 09:40 PM
Stma Stma is offline
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Hi all, many thanks for your responses and detailed input, very much appreciated.
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  #8  
Old 22-03-21, 09:46 PM
Stma Stma is offline
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Hi Luke, many thanks for posting the great pictures - excellent badges! From your last post, does this mean that upon review, do you no longer believe my badge to be genuine or just that it is not an Edwardian example? Please advise if you have time just so I can be sure. Many thanks. Rgds
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  #9  
Old 23-03-21, 03:12 PM
cbuehler cbuehler is offline
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Your badge is good, most likely of ww1 era manufacture.

CB
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  #10  
Old 23-03-21, 04:37 PM
denis pannett denis pannett is offline
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This thread has made my check my Connaught Rangers badges and I have this one I would be interested to hear your opinions of. It has a larger crown and very different back.
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  #11  
Old 23-03-21, 05:06 PM
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Luke H Luke H is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stma View Post
Hi Luke, many thanks for posting the great pictures - excellent badges! From your last post, does this mean that upon review, do you no longer believe my badge to be genuine or just that it is not an Edwardian example? Please advise if you have time just so I can be sure. Many thanks. Rgds
Your badge is still fine, just post Edwardian in my belief. As CB says entirely possible it is of WW1 manufacture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by denis pannett View Post
This thread has made my check my Connaught Rangers badges and I have this one I would be interested to hear your opinions of. It has a larger crown and very different back.
Not a genuine badge I’m afraid.
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  #12  
Old 28-03-21, 07:27 PM
Stma Stma is offline
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Hi all, thank you for you for your additional replies and input, much appreciated. Many thanks. Rgds.
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  #13  
Old 13-06-21, 07:34 PM
Stma Stma is offline
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Default Connaught Rangers Cap Badge WW1 - genuine or fake?

Hi all,

In addition to the original post on this thread, I am now posting pictures of another Connaught Rangers cap badge and would much appreciate any feedback on whether it might be genuine or fake if possible.

Please note that in some of the photos, I have once again placed the badge in question on the left side (badge in question has a gap between the crown and harp) next to a reproduction on the right side (without voided strings and an incorrect back) to perhaps give a better perspective on the badge in question.

My reasons for believing that the badge in question might be a fake are:

1) Unvoided strings (although as far as I am aware the Wilkinson’s reference guide says that Connaught Rangers badges with unvoided strings did also exist in WW1).
2) The brazing which attaches the slider to the badge looks like it is of copper and not brass.
3) The crimp mark in the slider looks more like a ‘kink’ in the slider (this is when the badge is viewed from side on) as opposed to a pressed crimp mark in the metal.

However, potential signs which show that the badge could also be genuine are:

1) Slider is slightly tapered with a potential genuine crimp mark
2) General shape of badge (including the mottled effect on the scroll with: Connaught Rangers has subtle / light dotting as opposed to heavy dotting)
3) Metal of the badge is quite thick and not thin, especially the slider
4) The detail on the back is crisp and not blurred

Any advice / guidance on whether the badge in question is genuine / reproduction would be much appreciated.

Many thanks for your assistance.

Best regards.
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  #14  
Old 13-06-21, 07:45 PM
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Luke H Luke H is offline
 
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I regard the badge you show as genuine, they are found with both voided and unvoided strings, there is always a void between the harp and crown. My belief is they are of WW1 manufacture.

A Royal Irish Regiment badge with similarly solid strings in shown in Wilkinson’s (1st edition i.e. 1969) book. Many of the line infantry and cavalry in his book appear to be drawn from a circa WW1 collection plus the quality, or rather lack of, also ties in with this era.
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  #15  
Old 14-06-21, 09:49 AM
Stma Stma is offline
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Hi Luke / all,

Many thanks for your post and input.

One of my main points for concern was that the badge in question seems to have copper brazing to join the slider to the main badge - I was told that copper brazing was only used on badges after 1948, indicating that this badge might perhaps be a later copy. Would you happen to know whether this is true / false info / not applicable in this case or have any other info on brazing techniques?

Many thanks and regards.
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