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  #1  
Old 13-05-12, 06:14 PM
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hertsmil hertsmil is offline
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Default Makers mark on Duke of Cornwall Light Infantry 1st Volunteer Battalion

Have just purchased two badges for the Duke of Cornwall Light Infantry 1st Volunteer Battalion.
one has a makers mark for Lambourne and Co Birmingham and the other has no makers marks at all.
I cant find any reference to this badge in any of my books such as Kipling and King or Cox with the scroll at the base of the badge, and cant find out from what date this badge is from.
Is it pre WW1 or WW1 or later, any help would be great.
Andy
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  #2  
Old 13-05-12, 06:45 PM
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Real Lambourne badges have the "O" in Co underlined.

Rgds,

Thomas.
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  #3  
Old 13-05-12, 06:55 PM
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Generally the Rifle Volunteers who were were formed from 1859 onwards became Volunteer Battalions of the Line Infantry (County ) Regiments following the Army reforms of the 1880`s.

On the formation of the Territorial Force in 1908 the Volunteer Battalions ( with the notable exception of the 7th ( Isle of Man ) V.B. Kings Liverpool Regiment ) became Territorial Battalions of the County Regiments.

Volunteer battalions therefore were in existance from the 1880`s until 1908.

( but as with almost everything connected to military history there were exceptions )

P.B.
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  #4  
Old 13-05-12, 07:02 PM
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Thanks for the information, does that mean that the one with no makers mark on the slider could be original.
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  #5  
Old 13-05-12, 07:24 PM
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The design of the badge illustrated is fig 265 in" Military Insignia of Cornwall" by Ivall and Thomas ( copy attached ) unfortunately they dont give details of the fittings found on this badge.

Fig 266 is described as "an alternative form with 1st V.B. on a small oval cartouche on the strings.

P.B.
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  #6  
Old 13-05-12, 08:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hertsmil View Post
Have just purchased two badges for the Duke of Cornwall Light Infantry 1st Volunteer Battalion.
one has a makers mark for Lambourne and Co Birmingham and the other has no makers marks at all.
I cant find any reference to this badge in any of my books such as Kipling and King or Cox with the scroll at the base of the badge, and cant find out from what date this badge is from.
Is it pre WW1 or WW1 or later, any help would be great.
Andy
Andy,
sorry to say your Lambourne marked badge is a copy and probably only a few years old, if that!

Andy
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  #7  
Old 13-05-12, 08:26 PM
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Many thanks for all the information about these badges, it's lucky that i did not pay a lot for the Lambourne marked badge only £8 but still not sure if the other one without makers mark is original or copy.
but i now know what to look for on the Lambourne makers mark, you learn as you go, and that's the great thing about this forum.
many thanks to all.
Andy
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  #8  
Old 08-03-16, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Brydon View Post
The design of the badge illustrated is fig 265 in" Military Insignia of Cornwall" by Ivall and Thomas ( copy attached ) unfortunately they dont give details of the fittings found on this badge.

Fig 266 is described as "an alternative form with 1st V.B. on a small oval cartouche on the strings.

P.B.
Peter,
Could you possibly post the legend that goes with the images please?

Andy
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  #9  
Old 08-03-16, 11:47 PM
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I've yet to see a badge of either versions that I would remotely call genuine. I have a couple of photos in my files of the men of the 1st VB wearing slouch hats and not one has any insignia, however those wearing FSC's feature the blackened badge below.
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  #10  
Old 09-03-16, 07:26 AM
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Keith makes a good point. To understand the VB badges then you need to appreciate the types of headgear in use.

Whilst the VBs could follow the Regular battalion practices; often they did vary and continued to wear older pattern hats. Some VB battalions did retain an affinity for the slouch hat, that had enjoyed brief popularity after the Boer War, until (and beyond) the formation of the TF.

When the Regulars moved to brodrick hats, many retained side caps. These often used collar badges or no badges at all.

Some regts did adopt the new peaked caps in 1908 and full sized cap badges were worn. However this was not universal and not all VBs needed such badges. This coincided with the 1905 awarding of South Africa battlehonours which, in the case of the Warwick VB and others, may have been an additional spur to create a new cap badge.

In this case I suspect that both variations of Cornwall VB are, like the Dorset VB badges, a product of fakers' imagination. The Dorsets wore side caps with the circular 16 number badge on them. It was not until the TF that the blank scrolled full sied badge is found.
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  #11  
Old 09-03-16, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Blakeman View Post
I've yet to see a badge of either versions that I would remotely call genuine. I have a couple of photos in my files of the men of the 1st VB wearing slouch hats and not one has any insignia, however those wearing FSC's feature the blackened badge below.
Keith and Alan,
Whilst I agree that the majority of the slidered DCLI bugle pattern badges with the overlaid plaque/plate or attached base scroll are fake, I'm not entirely convince they are fantasy? This one Dean posted looks rather well made and possibly original?

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...light=Cornwall

Andy
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  #12  
Old 09-03-16, 08:10 AM
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Genuine enough badge but the scroll may not be. May I draw your attention to this 1970s reference to fake DCLI VBs:

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...ad.php?t=33389
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  #13  
Old 09-03-16, 08:23 AM
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Alan,
Thanks, I do have Laurie's notes however, I think with the lack of images in support and their age, they are probably more of a historical reference than a hard and fast guide? They are now 40 years old.

I must say I like the badge Dean has posted and from the images it does not immeadiately scream fake. Not one I would personally discard until I was certain it was "made up"!

Andy
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  #14  
Old 09-03-16, 09:24 AM
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I would not discard it but I would want to see a period photo of such a badge or even the DCLI VB in peaked caps before I would be less uneasy with it. As you say 40 years old so looks the part for a fake of that age.
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  #15  
Old 09-03-16, 11:29 AM
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Whilst I have "No Doubts" that the Blackened POW topped badge is as Keith points out the OR's FSC badge. I have this one with the 1st VB overlaid oval, which will sit in my dubious file!

Andy
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