Scottish horse - sizes?

[Alan O]

Chaps,

Can any one tell me the height of a Scottish Horse cap badge compared to the collar badge? They were the same design and I presume both lugged.

Alan

[Saddle tree maker]

Alan,
I don't have any collar badges, but the 2 badges below are: Left cap/NCO arm badge in brass and Right is the cap badge (According to Cox).
They are different patterns, but are identical in size.
The are both - Height 46mm x Width 32mm.
Hope you find this of some use.
STM.

[Alan O]

Thanks. Mine is slightly different. W/M with a kings crown and no voiding of the wreath. It is 45mm high but only 30mm wide. It is die struck rather than cast (as I would expect an NCOs badge to be cast or solid backed?) and appears original.

Hopefully some one knows the collars' size?

Alan

[ncc]

1 3/8" x 1".

[Alan O]

NCC,

Thank you for that. I work only in metric but I think my mm dimensions are 1 7/8 INS H, 1 1/4INS W so that would make it considerably larger than a collar badge.

What I had not considered was the possibility of it being an Arm badge. It does not have the voided wreath of the cap badge shown above.

Alan

[ncc]

the arm badge i have is cast voided and 48mm x 32mm.the white metal cap badge is 45mm x 30mm and non voided.

[Saddle tree maker]

Alan,
According to Cox, the badge that I have shown in brass and the one you have are both described as cap badges, he then states that it is the brass/gilding metal one which was worn on the arm on black cloth backing.
His is the only reference for this I have seen, but to be honest, I would have thought the white metal one would have been the badge that doubled as the arm, because the amount of all brass NCO arm badges is very small and most are made from white metal or silver.
Of course with no conflicting evidence, I suppose we must go with the book for now.
STM.
I think some photographic evidence is needed here.
As regards whether or not it would be cast, I would say no. More probably semi die struck - ie just the male die used, making it flat backed. Having said that, if it was also a cap badge aswell, I have no problem with it being fully stamped out.

[rmarsden]

Two slightly different pattens WW1 brass,thin one 23mm x 36mm
fatter one 25mm x 36mm.
Ron

[Alan O]

Originally Posted by Saddle tree maker

Alan,

As regards whether or not it would be cast, I would say no. More probably semi die struck - ie just the male die used, making it flat backed. Having said that, if it was also a cap badge aswell, I have no problem with it being fully stamped out.

Yes I meant semi-die struck rather than cast. I believe that the k/c ones were worn later than the Scottish crown but wold seek confirmation of that. I do not trust any of Cox's 'unique' claims in his book as it is not 100% right in lots of places and shows a number of WW2 and later badges as WW1 era.

Alan

Am seeking a WW2 cap badge to the Scottish Horse, so K/C crown? Couldn't be the Scottish Crown for that period?
Cheers
Phil

[QOSY]

Originally Posted by Alan O

Yes I meant semi-die struck rather than cast. I believe that the k/c ones were worn later than the Scottish crown but wold seek confirmation of that. I do not trust any of Cox's 'unique' claims in his book as it is not 100% right in lots of places and shows a number of WW2 and later badges as WW1 era.

Alan

Alan I believe the LH flat backed badge (56X37) to be an arm badge. You can see that although there has been a terrible attempt to fix a slider to it, it was originaly lugged.
The RH badge (46X32) I am not 100% sure of, although it to looks like it may have marks for lugs.
Jim