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  #1  
Old 28-08-19, 07:10 PM
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Default Norfolk Regiment cap badge - restrike?

Hello,

I understand that sweat holes are considered a good sign of an original issue badge, this one has three holes (central hole hidden by slider). But despite that I have some reservations about this badge after comparing it to others on this site. I would appreciate your expert opinion, thank you.
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  #2  
Old 28-08-19, 07:35 PM
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Your one looks like the type that is not so tall as most off the common types, as well as it only has two berry’s on the Laurel leafs. The wear on the chest looks a little fake, but other than that I like it
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Old 28-08-19, 07:42 PM
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There is nothing wrong with your badge, there are many different variants of this badge. At least twelve off the top of my head.
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Old 28-08-19, 07:43 PM
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Many thanks. So this you believe to be an alternative version to a more common ('taller') type. Is this, do you think, a manufacturer difference, or were there variations in style due to a change in sealed patterns?
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Old 28-08-19, 07:44 PM
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Nozzer, thank you.
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  #6  
Old 28-08-19, 07:51 PM
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Just had a quick look and I have thirteen variants of the bi metal (BM) badge, with one 1916 all gilding metal (GM) badge that doesn't have a BM equivalent.

I really must try get back in to this game.
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  #7  
Old 28-08-19, 08:00 PM
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Thirteen? Good grief. I am pleased to find I have one original, let alone 13
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Old 28-08-19, 08:38 PM
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So does that imply there were 13 different sealed patterns if all of them differ in some way? Or is there evidence that the manufacturers had some leeway in what they produced?
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  #9  
Old 29-08-19, 04:27 AM
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The sealed pattern gave the required design, but each manufacturers design would differ slightly. This is the same for all badges I am sure and it certainly is to the main ones I collect. An example being the Hertfordshire Regiment of which I have found 15 variants, which knocks the "wide and narrow antler" variants in to touch as they vary from "wide" to "narrow" with every degree in between.
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Old 29-08-19, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSM View Post
So does that imply there were 13 different sealed patterns if all of them differ in some way? Or is there evidence that the manufacturers had some leeway in what they produced?
I would say there was some leeway, the pattern was a guide, and not followed exactly, unlike today, where we would expect an exact copy of the pattern.
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  #11  
Old 29-08-19, 08:53 AM
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It's also worth noting that badges were sold in NAAFI's, canteens and shops as replacement badges. In WW2 these were sometime bought to replace plastic ones - there was even a PQ in Parliament in 1944 about it.

These may have been sourced from other makers with different dies to the ones used for the s/p.
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Old 29-08-19, 05:59 PM
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Thanks for the replies, all very interesting. So I'm guessing that there is some confusion over which of the various 'styles' of the Norfolk badge is actually closest to the S/P? If all and sundry were making them and apparently selling them too, and NR squaddies were wearing what in effect are private purchase examples which deviate from the S/P, how can we tell today what was the 'official' example? Does a S/P with attached badge exist anywhere?

And Alan, is it possible please to learn more about the question (and answer)that was raised in Parliament?

Thanks again.
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  #13  
Old 30-08-19, 06:07 PM
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30 Mar 1944

Mr. Keeling

asked the Minister of Labour whether he is aware that service caps, metal buttons and woven or metal badges are manufactured for sale in shops to non-commissioned members of the forces, despite such caps being normally unauthorised and plastic buttons and printed or plastic badges being free issues; and whether he will withdraw labour wasted on such manufacture and sale and divert it to war work.

Mr. Bevin

There are no safeguards for labour engaged upon the manufacture ​ and sale of the articles mentioned by my hon. Friend for the purposes to which he refers. If, however, he will let me have particulars of the cases which he has in mind, I will have inquiries made.
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  #14  
Old 30-08-19, 06:08 PM
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10 Nov 1943

Mr. Keeling

asked the Minister of Production whether he is aware that large quantities of Service dress caps, metal buttons and woven or metal badges are sold in shops to non-commissioned members of the Forces, despite such caps being normally unauthorised and despite plastic buttons and printed or plastic badges being free issues; whether he releases materials for the manufacture of these articles; and whether, in the interests of security and of economy of materials and labour, he will prohibit the sale of any non-commissioned clothing or equipment normally issued officially?

Mr. Lyttelton

No releases of material are made for this purpose, but no doubt there are stocks of the finished articles and the small quantities of material that are required for work of this kind are not impossible to obtain, for instance, from ​ scrap. A prohibition of the sale of such goods would not be warranted as a means of saving the very small quantities of material that may be used.
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Old 30-08-19, 07:30 PM
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Thank you Alan, very interesting to read. It appears the issue is more a concern of diversion of labour and war material than the unofficial wearing of 'non-standard' insignia in the armed forces, but nonetheless it certainly highlights what you were saying about NAAFI sold items etc. Clearly it was going on, possibly at the 'cottage-industry' level of production? Thanks for taking the time to post.
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