Blackening of Badges

[mtrpltpara]

Hi All,
WW1, anyone know if there was a general order to have badges blackened when going in theatre?

Bill.

[KLR]

The WO listed the badges that were (in their terminology) "bronzed" - which means either blackened (as in eg rifle regiments) or browned (as in eg some yeomanry regiments).
I'm not sure that it was specifically related to going overseas (into theatre), more to do with the type of regiment and the badges they wore.

[iain]

did most inf'' rgts have at least one batt with a blackened badge i.e. 6th kings, 5th s. lancs, and i have recently come across a kings own with traces of black on it,and what is the story behind this, were they or previously rifle batt's ? iain

[mtrpltpara]

KLR, thanks for the reply, the reason i ask is that Laurie Milner, in his book Leeds Pals, quotes Private Yeadon... "had my badge blackened and fastened same in my (pith) helmet. (Feb. 1916, while in Egypt)

Bill.

[Peter Brydon]

Some time ago I was very kindly given a scrap book which contained bits and pieces relating to the Kings Liverpool Regt which was started in 1945.


Amongst the gems is a letter from H.J. Usher , a well known collector in the 1940`s and 1950`s,

In the letter H.J. says "..........in Gallipoli ( may1915-Jan 1916) ( Cape Helles) nearly all O/R of whatever unit blackened their badges with burnt rope and creosote to prevent reflection by the suns rays. I can vouch for this from personal experience"

P.B.

[mtrpltpara]

PB, thats very interesting, i wonder if something similar was done by the Leeds Pals.

Bill.

[KLR]

Bill, I was merely quoting what the central authorities did - which is what Iain was thinking of too.
Now that you mention a specific theatre event, Peter has come up trumps with a valuable piece of contemporary information. The mention of burnt rope and creosote is certainly NOT the way they would have bronzed (blackened) badges being manufactured in Britain, but an ad hoc theatre remedy.
I don't personally know much about Gallipoli (though a tad more about Eg & Pal) but yes, I reckon with a bit of searching around there may well be reference to the sort of 'order' you are after and I'd certainly be interested in finding it. I think this might repay some research into which units were at Gallipoli and in Egypt and what experience collectors have of badges not normally blackened that may be related to these theatres !
I could start off with a couple of examples. I have a cast brass King's badge (with loops rather than slider) that is known to have belonged to an officer in the 1st Garrison Bn KLR - which was stationed in Egypt. It does have very faint traces of blackening though I had wondered if it was a "local" version of an OSD badge.
I can also vouch for the fact that blackened bimetal 1896 pattern KLR cap badges genuinely exist (not just done by the unscrupulous !) - known from certain examples in museums etc from unassailable provenances. I had assumed they were done for the 5th Bn as emegency issue BUT they may have originated elsewhere too !
Julian

[dragonz18]

iain,
this may help you? Blackened King's Own !
Had this a long while.Came from a genuine family's WW1 'oddments' clearance(with other good WW1 items) here in NZ.
Badge is a 2 piece constuction, genuinely old, & puposely blackened!!
Have shown this B4,on another site,with no 'helpful' results.It may fit in here though?
With the NZ connection it could well have a Gallipoli/Palestine/Egypt context?
Any thoughts,anyone ?
Cheers !
Steve

PS:Not sure what burnt rope & creosote would actually look like !
Anyone willing to give it a try on some old broken badge ,to show us the results?

[Peter Brydon]

Would be an interesting experiment, but I understand you cannot obtain creosote any more ( or am I wrong ?)

P.B.

[Col Blacker]

Originally Posted by 8thfoot

Would be an interesting experiment, but I understand you cannot obtain creosote any more ( or am I wrong ?)

P.B.

Hi,

I think B&Q here in the UK - or some similar shop - still sell "creosote" - used to paint/preserve fences wood etc..

Sean

[Sonofacqms]

There was a reference to this method of blackening badges in "The Armourer" magazine some time ago. It was in the extracts of a diary by a 20th Hussar who served in Mesopotamia in WW1.

The original creosote which was used on railway sleepers, telegraph poles etc. was one of the finest wood preservers ever used. I believe the current "Health and Safety" laws stopped it being sold in DIY stores and substituted it for another type of preserver. This new type does not in my opinion hold up to the old creosote, quite what the result would be when mixed with burnt rope remains to be seen.

[Alan O]

Originally Posted by iain

did most inf'' rgts have at least one batt with a blackened badge i.e. 6th kings, 5th s. lancs, and i have recently come across a kings own with traces of black on it,and what is the story behind this, were they or previously rifle batt's ? iain

Iain,

The Blackened badges worn by the 6th Kings, 5th lancs, 5 E Surreys, 4th devons etc were as a result of their predecessor Volunteer bns having stylised themselves as Rifles Bn. When they were re-titled in 1908 with the creation of the Territorial Force, these Bns held onto their 'Rifle' heritage. These badges were black in peacetime rather than the wartime unofficial blackening alluded to in the first thread.

There was no Kings Own Rifles Bn I am afraid so your badge is either dirty or blackened for tactical reasons.

Alan

[Viletone]

Originally Posted by Alan Owen

Iain,

There was no Kings Own Rifles Bn I am afriad so your badge is either dirty or blackened for tactical reasons.

Alan

I agree. Another possibility is their temporary use as an officers badge. Some OSD's are almost back.

Creosote is a by product of coal tar. Lovely smell but pretty unhealthy for the lungs. It can still be bought, I passed a fence recently painted with it only the other day but it kills any plant life it comes in contact with. My old boss used to pour it down the drains at work when they became a bit smelly!

[mtrpltpara]

The original creosote is now banned from sale to DIY,in Britain, although substitutes exist. It can still be used by professionals but with restrictions.

[KLR]

Sonof ...
I'd be very grateful if you could find me the reference to the Armourer article on the 20th Hussar blackening.
Julian