Brigade Bars

[Bill A]

The Canadian army used a series of coloures strips above the divisional formation patch to denote the brigade HQ's in both WW1 and WW2. The sequence was green, senior brigade, red second in seniority, and blue for the junior brigade. (Jean Bouchery in The Canadian Soldier From D-Day to VE-Day shows the scheme as red, green, maroon, which is in error.)
Does anyone know the significanceof the colour sequence, if there is any? Or, can it be established that these were basically a random choice? The sequence was the same for both the Canadian Corps in WW1, and the Canadian Army (Active) in WW2.
A second question, does anyone have evidence of brigade HQ's in the home defence divisions, 6th, 7th and 8th, wearing brigade bars?

Illustrated are three canvas brigade bars, made by cutting down division patches, and one melton brigade bar, for second brigade in the division.

[fearnaught]

Hi, recently I picked up some bits from 3rd Div. included was the div sign and a grey bar. Does that mean div. HQ? The titles were HLI Canada and Glengarrians.

[Bill A]

The gray bars were from the CAOF (Canadian Army Occupation Force). They were worn under the formation patch and signified that the man was a member of that formation. The CAOF was basically a reconstituted 3 CID. It was short lived, formed in the late spring of 1945 and basically gone by the end of the spring of 1946. Check the image of the officer, R WPG R, in this string CAOF Insignia.

Could you post images of the titles and occupation force bars?

[fearnaught]

Originally Posted by Bill A

The gray bars were from the CAOF (Canadian Army Occupation Force). They were worn under the formation patch and signified that the man was a member of that formation. The CAOF was basically a reconstituted 3 CID. It was short lived, formed in the late spring of 1945 and basically gone by the end of the spring of 1946. Check the image of the officer, R WPG R, in this string CAOF Insignia.

Could you post images of the titles and occupation force bars?

Hi, Images. The HLI is the printed one. the Glengarrian is the worn printed one also there was a Lincoln & Welland which was the smaller greyer title. The badges that came with them had tartan backings. These were a thiner and finer cloth than British tartan backing, is this a Canadian thing?

[erracht]

Originally Posted by fearnaught

The badges that came with them had tartan backings. These were a thiner and finer cloth than British tartan backing, is this a Canadian thing?

Not necessarily. From what I have gathered, tartan badge backings were procured if & wherever possible. An excellent source was unserviceable kilts and trews; kilts being a heavy-weight tartan, trews usually a little less heavy. Barring this, tartan was acquired where possible - some units even using civilian sources (as in the case of 2nd Fife & Forfar Yeomanry, who wore a badge backing of Hunting Mackintosh, which is not an issue/military tartan).

Thus the Canadian Scottish badges I have (as well as imperial Scottish badges) have different weights and sett sizes of tartan backings, some even of the same tartan.

Hope this doesn't muddy the waters!

Dean

[Peter Brydon]

Most envious of the Beach group insignia worn on the Div sign and as worn by the Liverpool Irish
P.B.

[Bill A]

Fearnaught, A nice accumulation of titles. The brigade bar is worn below the 3rd CID patch. Interesting varieties of the RCA titles that you display. There are many varieties of these, and some are suspect. Can you do an image of the backing on these?
Note the SD & G canvas title. The fading that it shows is one of the reasons that many soldiers disliked the canvas. They faded when exposed to the elements, and were less serviceable than the good embroidered types.
erracht, the explanation about the backing is great. I have found any number of different types of tartan backing for badges. It is more about what is available than what is ordained.

[erracht]

Hi Bill,

As a follow-up I thought I would post some of the Cameron of Erracht tartan backings/swatches I have on hand. Notice that every one is different - either in sett size, thickness, or coarseness.

Dean

[fearnaught]

Hi, images of RCA

[Bill A]

Thanks for the images of the backs of the RCA titles. The canvas and the size back titles are no problem. The 3 AT RCA with the white cotton backing is a good title.
The other two cause me concerns. I don't like that odd 3 A.T. RCA slip-on. Can you see the embroidery behind the slip-on material? If so, what does it look like? Do you have any provenance on this title?
And, I don't like the looks of the 14 RCA. The backing is a loose weave. There have been a lot of the RCA titles show up over the last few years. Many are of dubious origins. If you have some background on them it would help.