RAF Pathfinder badge?

[Sock Monkey VC]

Righto, I was once told that the eagle used by Pathfinder squadrons was exactly the same as the eagle for cap badges. SAME BADGE the chap insisted. This despite the fact that you are constantly seeing badges advertised as genuine Pathfinder Squadron badges. Then I ran across this. Folding flat wires and a stiff brass backing.

I have shown it below a Canadian Breadner made RCAF cap badge.

Please weigh in on this one.

[Alex Rice]

No, for sure they never used blades for those badges because of the holes they would have had to make in their tunics. In my opinion that is just the centre eagle for a bullion officer's badge which has not been fitted to a badge.
Cheers,
Alex

[Sock Monkey VC]

Thanks. The possibility of it being a cap badge device makes sense. Mind you, I've never seen a cap badge of any sort that had a brass backer inside it (the few that I've seen pulled apart). They usually have just the wires folded over.

I do have my uncle's WW2 tunics and they have pathfinder badges like this on the pockets but with screw post fasteners on them. Frankly I think they leave as big a hole in the tunic as this one would.

A look at the old supply books would be nice to see if a pathfinder's badge was a separately listed item.

The brass backing plate remains the big hang up for me with this one.

Monkey

[Frank Kelley]

Quite frankly, any eagle worn by an entitled member of 8 Group, as a Pathfinder badge, is indeed, a Pathfinder badge, do you know who it actually belonged to, if not, it is merely an eagle.

Originally Posted by Sock Monkey VC

Righto, I was once told that the eagle used by Pathfinder squadrons was exactly the same as the eagle for cap badges. SAME BADGE the chap insisted. This despite the fact that you are constantly seeing badges advertised as genuine Pathfinder Squadron badges. Then I ran across this. Folding flat wires and a stiff brass backing.

I have shown it below a Canadian Breadner made RCAF cap badge.

Please weigh in on this one.

[silverwash]

well said that man !

[leigh kitchen]

One of the more interesting threads on Pathfinder badges:

https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/fo...ead.php?t=4355

[Sock Monkey VC]

That was an informative thread indeed, especially the part where the chap from the Pathfinder museum said original examples were found in three different forms. It pretty much confirms that the RAF played "catch as catch can" and issued whatever was in stores to Pathfinder crew. I was surprised to hear Bennett sent out a letter of qualification to each member??? This must have been a bulk produced item. I can't see him having drafted hundreds of them.

OK, so I have a pretty badge, perfectly consistent with the ones already on my uncle's uniforms but JUST a pretty badge at this point as it didn't come from him.

Monkey

[Frank Kelley]

How is it possible to attach anything to a tunic without making a hole or using a form of glue?

Originally Posted by Alex Rice

No, for sure they never used blades for those badges because of the holes they would have had to make in their tunics. In my opinion that is just the centre eagle for a bullion officer's badge which has not been fitted to a badge.
Cheers,
Alex

[Sock Monkey VC]

You're quite right. I don't think many things had clutch pin fasteners back then. In this case we're talking about dress uniforms not battledress so the insignia just stayed on. I don't think they were worried about holes.

Just as an aside, I have three uniforms here. One blue tunic, one olive (summer I assume) and one khaki. The khaki uniform has peaked cuffs like a bandsman's uniform although it's just a seam without any colour difference. It has shoulder straps that have holes in them as if rank pips had been attached at one point but then there is his pilot officer stripe around the cuff, buttons and the three ribbons he had earned to that point. There is no question about provenance as he handed them to Mum at one point just after the war.

After his tours he returned to Canada to instruct gunnery at Boundary Bay. Could that be where the khaki came in? His log shows he never went near North Africa but bombed only in Germany, France and Italy with 83 Sqn.

Was it common for an RCAF chap to wear khaki and what so obviously looks like a repurposed army tunic?

Thanks.

[Frank Kelley]

Indeed, a hole is a just that, a hole.
Regarding your aside, I take it he was a member of the RCAF, but, on operations with 83, which flew from Great Britain, so I assume his uniforms are Canadian too, the khaki uniform with his ribbons worn in Canada?
Perhaps another thread in the RCAF section would be the way to go.

Originally Posted by Sock Monkey VC

You're quite right. I don't think many things had clutch pin fasteners back then. In this case we're talking about dress uniforms not battledress so the insignia just stayed on. I don't think they were worried about holes.

Just as an aside, I have three uniforms here. One blue tunic, one olive (summer I assume) and one khaki. The khaki uniform has peaked cuffs like a bandsman's uniform although it's just a seam without any colour difference. It has shoulder straps that have holes in them as if rank pips had been attached at one point but then there is his pilot officer stripe around the cuff, buttons and the three ribbons he had earned to that point. There is no question about provenance as he handed them to Mum at one point just after the war.

After his tours he returned to Canada to instruct gunnery at Boundary Bay. Could that be where the khaki came in? His log shows he never went near North Africa but bombed only in Germany, France and Italy with 83 Sqn.

Was it common for an RCAF chap to wear khaki and what so obviously looks like a repurposed army tunic?

Thanks.