The eagle (well, Griffin) has landed - British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

3dg · #1 14-03-23, 12:41 PM

Hello
My latest addition to my Ayrshire Yeomanry OR's cap badges, this little beauty, a bi metal, possibly S/NCO's cap badge, really chuffed!
Thank you to Geoff Newman.
I say possibly S/NCO's, but not confirmed yet with photographic evidence, definitely purchased or issued and worn at some point.
I'll continue this thread regarding this badge later, I've a few notes and findings.

Cheers

Chris

Home Guard · #2 14-03-23, 03:12 PM

Very nice badge, and totally agree, Geoff is a true gentleman to deal with!

Terry

3dg · #3 14-03-23, 07:58 PM

Thank you Terry, a really nicely made badge also.

Chris

Alan O · #4 14-03-23, 08:17 PM

The right way up

Alan O · #5 14-03-23, 08:18 PM

and the reverse

3dg · #6 14-03-23, 08:21 PM

Cheers Alan
Appreciated

3dg · #7 15-03-23, 09:50 PM

210 views,.and one reply. (Cheers Terry)
Just thought I'd share my newest arrival.
I'd say no one is interested in any of my info regarding the badge, which is cool, so I'm signing this one off
Cheers

Chris

Paul Spellman · #8 15-03-23, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3dg

210 views,.and one reply. (Cheers Terry)
Just thought I'd share my newest arrival.
I'd say no one is interested in any of my info regarding the badge, which is cool, so I'm signing this one off
Cheers

Chris

Chris, You said you would continue the thread with your findings
People are likely waiting on any further info you have to add
Paul

Calpe · #9 16-03-23, 07:36 AM

Hi Chris,

A great find. Well done.

Regards,
Ian

3dg · #10 16-03-23, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Spellman

Chris, You said you would continue the thread with your findings
People are likely waiting on any further info you have to add
Paul

Hello Peter
You're probably right, I have left my thread open to my findings.
This is a rare badge, and I enjoy the shared enthusiasm of this forum.
I'll pop my toys back in my pram and continue this thread later.
Thanks Peter,

Chris

3dg · #11 16-03-23, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calpe

Hi Chris,

A great find. Well done.

Regards,
Ian

Thank you Ian

3dg · #12 16-03-23, 03:25 PM

Here are my findings for the Bi metal Ayrshire Yeomanry cap badge.

Characteristics of the badge.
I've seen four examples of the badge, three have a solid back, one is die stamped. All the solid back ones have the WM lions head attached by two pin like fittings, the die stamped one has been affixed on with brazing.
The die for the badge is very similar to that of the 1920's badge described in post 6 & 7 in my Running order of the Ayrshire Yeomanry OR's cap badge thread here
https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/fo...ad.php?t=90413
And I've attached an example of the badge in the photos.
The wing tips are the same, as is the closest ear on the lions head, which is longer than the one on the later dies of this badge, a later die example is on post 33 of the above thread.
The chin however has been cut out from the wing.

The dating of the badge can only go by the examples I've seen.
The badge marked with the small JR Gaunt London mark would be late 40's, perhaps early 50's, the die stamped one with the large JR Gaunt London mark is probably late 50's/60's, note the two marks on both wings, more on those later.
My example has no makers mark, mine is a similar one to the one Keith Hook has in his collection, there is also an example of the same badge but with loops.
These badges maybe just a different maker, or just simply an unmarked slider version, so probably 50's, or maybe earlier, I don't know.
I had a discussion with Keith Hook regarding this badge.
Keith has in his possession an undated section CB catalogue that was given to him in the sixties, it gives the numbers as follows,

CB 1832 G.M. and W.M. and 1235 G.M. O.P. (old pattern).

It's interesting that it's in the CB section, with a number which also shows of its existence and issue. Also reading that the GM badge was an 'old' pattern, was this bi metal badge an all other ranks badge, possibly replacing the all GM badge before the anodised?

Another reasoning for it possibly being a SNCO's cap badge is the possibility of it also being worn as a SNCO's rank badge.
I don't know when the practice of wearing a looped badge as a SNCO's rank badge came into being, but this bi metal badge is also found on loops, example shown the flat solid back version.
Coming back to the large font JR Gaunt London mark die stamped badge, note on the wings there are marks to fit loops if required, is this for the rank badge version?

Whether this badge was issued or private purchase under regimental expense I don't know yet, my quest for a photo still eludes me.
Either way, whether on the SD cap, beret or whatever headdress, I believe this badge was issued or bought, but definitely worn.

Any input will be greatly appreciated .

Many thanks, I hope this is of interest.

Chris

Paul Spellman · #13 16-03-23, 04:35 PM

Unfortunately I can’t tell you where these are as I fear I would be breaking forum rules
I’m sure the Gilt/Wm SNCOs badge central is similar to yours in the op
Paul

Mike H · #14 16-03-23, 05:34 PM

I was always curious as to why there was a well fed Griffin and an under fed one.
They are totally different in size and even an untrained eye would notice it.

Alan O · #15 16-03-23, 05:50 PM

I have always assumed the underfed one was early and not liked - if anyone has one then the maker would confirm this.