Machine Gun Corps- Pipe Majors?

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by 1stTankie

Hi Hussar

Many thanks for your post.
I suspect it was not unusual to find our Pipes and Drums in a bar, piping especially is very thirsty work but its nice to know that "Boom-boom" found the time and strength for romance as well!

Best wishes

Gordon

It wasn't the only thing you guys left behind. The landlord had a shoebox full of beermats. Everytime one of us was going on leave she would ask if we were going near Tidworth or Warminster

Originally Posted by badjez

Just for information, the rank of Drum-major didn't exist during the life of the MGC. It was introduced on 31.07.28. by Army Order 139. Prior to that the rank was Serjeant drummer. The same applied to Pipe-major, bugle-major etc.

Stephen.

Very useful information. Thank you.

Originally Posted by Staffsyeoman

I'm not disagreeing with you. They were created for the RTR. I wouldn't have bought them if they were fantasy items; they perpetuated the cap badge. I was just trying to stop anyone running away with the idea of MGC pipe bands.

Ah but we have no proof that p&d didn't exist in the MGC. As I said: where you have Scots and Irish you have pipes. I personally doubt they had organised bands as it was wartime but they must have had pipers or else there would have been no pipers badges. Would you agree?

[oc14]

"Ah but we have no proof that p&d didn't exist in the MGC. As I said: where you have Scots and Irish you have pipes. I personally doubt they had organised bands as it was wartime but they must have had pipers or else there would have been no pipers badges. Would you agree?
"
No I wouldn't agree - there is no proof that MGC P & D did exist and this is simply supposition - surely some photographic evidence would have survived somewhere !. Gordon (who has first hand knowledge) states that (as I suspected) the MGC plaid brooch was worn by RTR P & D, is modern and was never worn by any MGC unit. I am with Staffs Yeoman on this one, the plaid brooch is RTR and not MGC. The MGC badge is a bit of a red herring.

PL

[Alan O]

I agree - it's most likely a modern badge from 4RTR. Unless you can find one with a 1918 hallmark then the balance of probability is not good.

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by oc14

"Ah but we have no proof that p&d didn't exist in the MGC. As I said: where you have Scots and Irish you have pipes. I personally doubt they had organised bands as it was wartime but they must have had pipers or else there would have been no pipers badges. Would you agree?
"
No I wouldn't agree - there is no proof that MGC P & D did exist and this is simply supposition - surely some photographic evidence would have survived somewhere !. Gordon (who has first hand knowledge) states that (as I suspected) the MGC plaid brooch was worn by RTR P & D, is modern and was never worn by any MGC unit. I am with Staffs Yeoman on this one, the plaid brooch is RTR and not MGC. The MGC badge is a bit of a red herring.

PL

Originally Posted by Alan O

I agree - it's most likely a modern badge from 4RTR. Unless you can find one with a 1918 hallmark then the balance of probability is not good.

I'm very inclined to agree with you both but having served and knowing how the army works and even seeing for myself the emergence of the QRIH p&d, off establishment, I'd be wary about saying there were no pipers at all in the MGC. I'd be very sceptical about anything official but it would be an interesting research project to go through MGC records to see if there were any unofficial pipers utilised for morale purposes. That wouldn't be unusual.

[Peter Brydon]

I have never come across any references to Pipes and Drums in the MGC and think the plaid brooches you see are modern but then, there is the illustration on Plate F, No3 in "Scottish Units in the World Wars" by Mike Chappell which shows a sergeant of the 51st Bn MGC 1918 who is wearing his MGC badge on a T.O.S.

The text says Machine Gunners of the 51st continued to wear Scottish headdress after the creation of the MGC, refusing to adopt the service dress cap.

I would be very surprised if there were MGC pipers but as with most thing military it is perhaps best to keep an open mind.

P.B.

[Hussar100]

Originally Posted by 8thfoot

I have never come across any references to Pipes and Drums in the MGC and think the plaid brooches you see are modern but then, there is the illustration on Plate F, No3 in "Scottish Units in the World Wars" by Mike Chappell which shows a sergeant of the 51st Bn MGC 1918 who is wearing his MGC badge on a T.O.S.

The text says Machine Gunners of the 51st continued to wear Scottish headdress after the creation of the MGC, refusing to adopt the service dress cap.

I would be very surprised if there were MGC pipers but as with most thing military it is perhaps best to keep an open mind.

P.B.

That's exactly what I am suggesting. Who's to say the 51st didn't have pipers with them who continued to give their services unofficially? Or if some wee Irish piper happened to transfer in from the 36th Div why would he not continue to play his pipes?

[badgecollector]

hi all
what are the thoughts of these items
whats the 51 belong to?
cheers
bc

[Alex Rice]

Is that a maker's name on the catch of the belt buckle?