Loyal Suffolk Hussars 1759 !

[Parabellum]

Do you have a strong eye glass Mark ?

Look to see if there are any hairline joins on the back of the 5, I noticed on pic 3 on the QMS listing it looks a bit off.

Also, the top of the 5 should be more like the 1 and 7, if it's the same font and it doesn't, it just has a little quif *




* Like Tintin.

[Luke H]

Originally Posted by mm1

Hi Griff,

please forgive my ignorance, but what would that show ? I will more than likely be returning the badge, so do not want to risk damaging it..

Cheers, Mark

It would remove the tarnish/patina and bring the badge up looking close to new.

If you are intending on returning the item I would suggest you don’t do this as the seller would have quite a strong cause in my opinion to refuse your refund as it would not be in the same condition which you received it.

[manchesters]

Mark,

If you are thinking of returning it do not do anything to it. The vendor would not want it back after such treatment I am sure.

I dont know the answer to your question but make the following observations.

1. Why would an officer display an incorrect cap badge (ie wrong date)?

2. I would expect to see silver loops on an officers quality badge.

3. It does look Birmingham Mint type (there are other modern reproduction sets) from the rear, but if I recall correctly all theirs had sliders?

4. Not all badges conform to what we would normally see.

I am sorry if that doesnt help you.

regards

[mm1]

I will not be doing anything to the badge before returning.If I was trying to talk myself into keeping it, my thoughts would be that the badge was made with incorrect date and somehow left the place of manufacture, so if that is the case, then it has not been worn so an officer will not have worn it.
Also, if this is a Birmingham Mint badge then why have the incorrect date ?

Too many if's and buts on this badge, so more than likely to go back.

Cheers, Mark

[kingsley]

The badge I had all those years ago certainly pre-dates the Birmingham Mint
manufacture, and Arthur Miller and I were happy to accept it as an original.

[grey_green_acorn]

Having put some effort into providing details of the Birmingham Mint products see https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/fo...hp?albumid=767

I can say with some certainty that the two ‘collections’ did not include Yeomanry badges.
The first collection covered 52 infantry regiments and 3000 sets were sold. The second collection titled ‘The Queen’s Guards’ covered the Household Division and seems to have sold in much lower numbers. Badges from both sets do appear on auction sites often mis-described as ‘officers badges’.

Yes all badges were fitted with ‘vertical shanks’ (sliders) as they were intended to be mounted with their associated silver medallions in purpose made display cabinets or frames.

However, as said by Simon, there are other manufacturers / sources of reproductions.

Tim

[Luke H]

Not collecting officers badges my knowledge on them is limited v’s other ranks.

As I said the pinned scroll construction and how they’d been left bent over reminded me of B’ham mint but if those in the know say this wasn’t included in their series and they were around before this then I would treat that as gospel.

If an officer’s badge as it now appears to be then I would suggest it would have originally been gilt and silver plate. From the photos the finish appears to have suffered somewhat.

[mm1]

Parabellum - no joins visible, the numeral 5 looks like it has always been with the other numerals.In terms of other faker, would it make sense to make a badge with the wrong date just on the off chance that one day someone would think it a rare manufacturers error ?

Mark

[Luke H]

Quite simply a mistake by the maker, whoever that may have been.

Genuine examples of the 21st London are found with 1803 and 1903 date. Similarly 19th London’s exist with battle honour ‘1899-1902’ and ‘1900-02’.

If kingsley had one of these in the 1960s it would make it unlikely to be a repro in my belief.

[mm1]

Hi Luke, do the examples of the 21st Londons demand high prices ? Do you know if one has been sold recently ?

Cheers, Mark

[Luke H]

No. The prices for 21st and 19th London’s with correct or erroneous dates are the same. My point with those, rather than pricing, was to highlight manufacturers mistakes with dates are not uncommon on some badges.

But I don’t really think prices of the above necessarily correlate to your LSH.

Questions are 1. Are you happy with its authenticity and condition? and 2. What’s it worth to you? The latter answer will be different for everyone depending their answer to the first question and where it does or does not fit into their collection.

[Parabellum]

Sometimes, feedback on a badge can be inconclusive, and that doesn't mean it's bad, it just means that no one can be sure 100% either way.

If you like the badge, keep it until someone comes along with more information. There are hundreds of members on here and Less than 10 have commented and unfortunately you're not really any the wiser.

Neil.

[mm1]

Cheers Neil,

yes - I've got some thinking to do on this one ...

Mark

[Fatherofthree]

Greetings.

My two Bobs worth: if it is a manufacturer's error, surely there would be more than the two mentioned items known.

As Luke has touched on, both 19th and 21st London badges show both correct and incorrect dates and are accepted as errors and both are frequently seen, which would indicate both incorrect and correct dies being cut and used.

However, in respect of the badge, subject of this thread, two only are believed to be known/found/discovered.

Using the London badges as examples, surely there should be more in existence, unless after striking 2 badges the dies were discarded.

Having said all that, I'm none the wiser as to the authenticity of this badge.

Hoping somebody will have an answer.

Regards.

Brian

[mm1]

Cheers Brian,

I think that makes 3 - this badge, the ground dug badge and the one Kingsley owned. At this point, I would like to try and ascertain authenticity of the badge in terms of it being a legitimate Officers badge as a couple of members have expressed concerns over the lugs..

be safe, Mark