British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum

Recent Books by Forum Members

   

Go Back   British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum > British Military Insignia > General Topics.

 Other Pages: Galleries, Links etc.
Glossary  Books by Forum Members     Canadian Pre 1914    CEF    CEF Badge Inscriptions   Canadian post 1920     Canadian post 1953     British Cavalry Badges     Makers' Marks    Pipers' Badges  Canadian Cloth Titles  Books  SEARCH
 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-05-21, 10:45 PM
cbuehler cbuehler is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 2,140
Default Indian Army section

I have often felt that the Indian Army section of this forum deserves a better presence than it presently has; stuck in a little seen subsection at the bottom, with a rather sleepy level of activity.
The increasing interest and value of Indian badges, not to mention the historical connection and contribution to the Commonwealth equal to or greater than any, would, I believe, encourage a more vigorous participation from members and perhaps spark more collectors to venture further into this field.
What say ye?

CB
__________________
Bdr. Parker Windle MM, A Btry. 210th (E. Lancs.) RFA WW1 , fr. Burnley
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-05-21, 11:30 PM
lettman lettman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 977
Default

I've recently developed a better awareness and more interest in Indian badges, so I support the motion.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-05-21, 11:57 PM
Artynut Artynut is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada.
Posts: 722
Default

There IS an interest in Indian Army militaria but it was and is such a huge country with a population many times that of the rest of all the commonwealth countries put together. It would be hard to specialise in one particular Regiment, so one might be inclined to collect to All the Sikh regiments or the Armoured regiments. If you collect Indian up to 1948, which ever arm or corps, it’s still a difficult proposition. My own interest is Artillery of the Commonwealth Nations and again, with countries leaving the Commonwealth, it becomes a question of scarcity of pieces from pre-indipendance and even reference material. I DO have some “Indian” Artillery badges but no where near the number you would think come from a country that size. In fact, I believe I have more Buttons than badges. It’s place in the listing on the forum is I believe in the proper place, I view it every day. If more members had an interest, it would reflect in the number of posts. Best regards, D.J.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-05-21, 01:03 AM
lifeochil's Avatar
lifeochil lifeochil is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 147
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artynut View Post
It would be hard to specialise in one particular Regiment, so one might be inclined to collect to All the Sikh regiments or the Armoured regiments.
I disagree. I collect to a specific group and they're neither Sikh nor armoured.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-05-21, 05:46 AM
lettman lettman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 977
Default

I think there's a case for expanding the Indian section a little. I'd suggest by time periods, e.g.
pre-1903
1903-1922
1922-1947
post 1947

As to the issue of number of posts, it's possible that expanding the categories might actually generate more posts.

Having said that, I'm fine with the status quo as well.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-05-21, 07:20 AM
Hawthorn's Avatar
Hawthorn Hawthorn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Surrey England
Posts: 723
Default

Looking at Dealers lists there appears to be more Indian related militaria appearing on the market, I don't know if that's more interest from Collectors or Dealers having difficulty finding other militaria to list.

I myself have just bought an oldish collection of cast Indian badges which I am currently in the process of sorting and will attempt to show some items in the Indian section shortly.

Regards, Simon.
__________________
Second To None
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-05-21, 07:53 AM
Wmr-RHB's Avatar
Wmr-RHB Wmr-RHB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,080
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lettman View Post
I think there's a case for expanding the Indian section a little. I'd suggest by time periods, e.g.
pre-1903
1903-1922
1922-1947
post 1947

As to the issue of number of posts, it's possible that expanding the categories might actually generate more posts.

Having said that, I'm fine with the status quo as well.
For some it will be of no surprise that I warn to be careful using 1947 as an important date for badge collecting (on the subcontinent). It might be the year for independence, but the units of both armies that evolved from it were still much the same, having the same regiments and corps (allbeith many companies were exchanged to sort out the so called "classes"). Special the infantry and cavalry (armoured) regiments lived on with the same titles and subtitles (including Royal and Prince of Wales's, etc.). King George VI was still head of state of both countries. As a result most badges stayed also the same.

It is only when India became a republic in 1950 and Pakistan became a republic in 1956 that the changes in designations and badges emerged.

In short, not 1947, but 1950 resp. 1956 are the important dates for badge collectors.

And about the original subject. I assume that it is not the place in the rank of sub-forums or the number of posts that influences the number of eager collectors, but that it is the other way around. The number of collectors will influence the number of posts. After all the name "British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum" is clear enough. And once someone with interest in British India/India/Pakistan found it, (s)he will not have much problems finding the correct place for her/his questions within the forum.
__________________
Henk

Interested in the lineage of the unit your badge represents?
Try: Regimental lineages
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-05-21, 08:18 AM
lettman lettman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 977
Default

It was just a suggestion.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-05-21, 08:25 AM
Wmr-RHB's Avatar
Wmr-RHB Wmr-RHB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,080
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lettman View Post
It was just a suggestion.
I understand, but as it seems that 1947/independence is seen by many the deciding date, I try to increase awareness about this in badge collectors. You may value this as a small "hobby horse" of mine.
__________________
Henk

Interested in the lineage of the unit your badge represents?
Try: Regimental lineages
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-05-21, 02:43 PM
cbuehler cbuehler is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 2,140
Default

I collect British Indian Army, and often forget there is that little sub forum down there. South Africa has it's own section that is even less active than the obscure Indian one.
Well, at any rate, I fully agree that collectors should be aware that 1947 is not the date when badges were actually changed. The same applies with British crown changes, such as QVC ending in 1901, or KC ending in 1953. It surely took years to effect the change.
But collectors need a reference point to date badges and these dates do serve such a purpose.

CB
__________________
Bdr. Parker Windle MM, A Btry. 210th (E. Lancs.) RFA WW1 , fr. Burnley
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-05-21, 03:07 PM
Wmr-RHB's Avatar
Wmr-RHB Wmr-RHB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,080
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cbuehler View Post
I collect British Indian Army, and often forget there is that little sub forum down there. South Africa has it's own section that is even less active than the obscure Indian one.
Well, at any rate, I fully agree that collectors should be aware that 1947 is not the date when badges were actually changed. The same applies with British crown changes, such as QVC ending in 1901, or KC ending in 1953. It surely took years to effect the change.
But collectors need a reference point to date badges and these dates do serve such a purpose.

CB
But here there is a difference. The the "official" starting point of changing QVC to KC is clear when KIng Edward VII took over. And then it took time to implement it.

But in this case, the "official" date is NOT 1947. It is 1950 and 1956 and from those points on the implementations start.

E.g. until 1956 there was still Probyn's Horse (5th King Edward VII's Own) in the Pakistan Army. Same designation since 1937, same badge (with POW feathers) since 1922. That was NOT due to something like the using up of stock, or failure of creating a new design.

For history 1947 is very important, for the badge collector it is very minor. The "reference points" as you call them are 1950 resp. 1956, NOT 1947.
__________________
Henk

Interested in the lineage of the unit your badge represents?
Try: Regimental lineages
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-05-21, 03:20 PM
cbuehler cbuehler is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 2,140
Default

You do have a very valid point here. I would actually favor changing the reference dates to 50 and 56, but I think it would be rather difficult for an already entrenched practice.

CB
__________________
Bdr. Parker Windle MM, A Btry. 210th (E. Lancs.) RFA WW1 , fr. Burnley
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-05-21, 03:37 PM
Wmr-RHB's Avatar
Wmr-RHB Wmr-RHB is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,080
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cbuehler View Post
You do have a very valid point here. I would actually favor changing the reference dates to 50 and 56, but I think it would be rather difficult for an already entrenched practice.

CB
Yes, that is the difficulty. Battling windmills
__________________
Henk

Interested in the lineage of the unit your badge represents?
Try: Regimental lineages
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-05-21, 04:08 PM
Home Guard's Avatar
Home Guard Home Guard is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 1,141
Default

I collect Indian women's service and nursing, as well as S>Africa, Canada, Australia and New Zealand as being part of my British and Commonwealth pursuit. However, Indian and S. Africa are less avaiable so I don't have much.

Terry
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-05-21, 10:45 PM
Mike's Avatar
Mike Mike is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: North of Hadrian's Wall
Posts: 2,255
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wmr-RHB View Post
Yes, that is the difficulty. Battling windmills
You mean 'tilting at'?
__________________
My insignia database contributions
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:44 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.