15th loodianah Sikhs Pagri Badge "Date"

[keflin2612]

Who's your "expert"

[Khyber]

Hi Piffer,
Yes the badge is a cast badge and the usual ones I've seen are die struck British made. As i told Kev, the reverse does not look great and it's been probably cast locally in India. But might be authentic in the sense that it might be used by other ranks as opposed to the silver ones worn by officers. I suppose you asked Ashok? I thought of sending him a pic but i bother him every other day so thought i would avoid
Problem with Indian badges now is there are a lot of cast copies so becoming a minefield. And some copies are extremely well made. The obverse of this badge is pretty decent though, i would say.

[keflin2612]

I'm sorry, but I have the badge in my possession I've looked at it, held it, looked at and pulled the very old and very loose pin and I think it's naivety and probable fact that it was made in India, makes me think it's right.

Kev.

[Piffer]

Originally Posted by Khyber

Hi Piffer,
Yes the badge is a cast badge and the usual ones I've seen are die struck British made. As i told Kev, the reverse does not look great and it's been probably cast locally in India. But might be authentic in the sense that it might be used by other ranks as opposed to the silver ones worn by officers. I suppose you asked Ashok? I thought of sending him a pic but i bother him every other day so thought i would avoid
Problem with Indian badges now is there are a lot of cast copies so becoming a minefield. And some copies are extremely well made. The obverse of this badge is pretty decent though, i would say.

Hi Khyber and Kev,
That it's cast and most likely locally made from an original die struck badge for use by other ranks is a possibility. According to Ashok Nath this type of badge was worn by BO's and Native officers and also by NCO'S and members of the regimental band on special occasions. Other ranks wore XV with a quoit as it's shown in Sowars and Sepoys as nr 345. For field service they had a plain blackened quoit shown as nr 347. Since his book was published in 2014, Ashok also mentioned that he had noted, although its not mentioned in his book, after having seen contemporary photographs of 15th Sikhs that a plain silver quoit was worn by BO's on their SD caps. Let me see if I can can request for some images obverse/reverse of authentic badge worn by the 15th Sikhs. Piffer

[keflin2612]

I'll be very interested to see what you find out Piffer, thanks for the help.

Kev

[Piffer]

Originally Posted by keflin2612

Hi my fellow badgers,
Picked this pagri badge up the other week, I thought it going to be dated to around 1900 but when it arrived and I'd actually looked at it in the flesh, I think it seems to be older than I first thought. Could someone with a bit more knowledge than me tell me what sort of date it could actually be please.
Cheers.

Kev.

Here are images front and back of an authentic 15th Sikhs pagri badge, for comparisons...sent to me by a friend with permission to upload it in this forum, hope this helps. Piffer

[Khyber]

Originally Posted by Piffer

Here are images front and back of an authentic 15th Sikhs pagri badge, for comparisons...sent to me by a friend with permission to upload it in this forum, hope this helps. Piffer

Hi Piffer. This is the real thing. Kev's badge may well have been cast from such an example. Ive seen cast copies to many Indian regiments but not one to the 15th though. Always a bit iffy therefore.
I have the plain quoit badge to the 15th that is not included innS&S which Ashok did say might be to the regiment.
Been looking for the 15th badge under discussion for long. Hopefully one day will come across a silver officers badge.

[Piffer]

Originally Posted by Khyber

Hi Piffer. This is the real thing. Kev's badge may well have been cast from such an example. Ive seen cast copies to many Indian regiments but not one to the 15th though. Always a bit iffy therefore.
I have the plain quoit badge to the 15th that is not included innS&S which Ashok did say might be to the regiment.
Been looking for the 15th badge under discussion for long. Hopefully one day will come across a silver officers badge.

Khyber, The images of the authentic badge to 15th Sikhs uploaded for comparison is via courtesy of our common friend Captain Ashok Nath and from his collection. Many Indian badges were cast and therefore are genuine, one has to be very careful and might be a good thing to check with a senior experienced collector. There are also die struck badges to Gurkha Regiments made in UK which are aged and then being passed off as genuine.