Belfast Harbour Police Info
 

Good aftrenoon all,
Does anybody know what period the uncrowned, white metal Belfast Harbour Police cap badge was in use for? (The star version)
Billyh

Hi Billyh

According to Messrs Wilkinson and Cowdell 1931-1935, followed by the same in chrome 1935-1939, with the KC added 1939-date (pub. 2019).

Hope this helps

Graham

Thanks Graham. I knew the period for white metal curteousey of Dave, but You've given me the the specific info for Belfast Harbour
Billyh

Information as above. Here is the book I have with this info in.

One question I'd like an answer to is, should the badge be voided? because the one I have ordered isn't, but I have the option to return it.
Billyh

If the badge is solid and not voided, its a repro. Send it back. Total crap.

Dave.

Thanks Dave.
Billyh

It seems to me that there is a danger of the non voided repro of this badge becoming accepted as the real and genuine article. Because looking around online, DNW, who you may think would know what's what, have previously listed one as genuine. The same goes for other dealers and auction sites. The PMC Club also have one shown under British Police Insignia. It wasn't until I saw the image posted by Jerry, that I thought to question it's authenticity.
Billyh

That particular badge was always voided. Anything with a solid centre has been made in the last 20 years or so and is a repro. It was never a large force, so with such a large number of these about, in crisp clean condition with no rubbing it should be fairly obvious that they are repro.

Dave.

If the badge is clean and crisp, then yes, it should be fairly obvious Dave. But the one I bought isn't in that condition, and came from a specialist dealer, hence my last post. Let's face it, you might think the Police Memorabilia Collectors Club wouldn't have the non voided as an example of a good badge. So without having people with your knowledge on the subject I think there is a risk of this badge eventually being seen as a good genuine one.
Billyh

The guy that runs the Police Memorabilia Collectors Club is not particularly knowledgeable. The majority of the images which they show are, in the main, downloaded from various other sites, eBay etc. As a result, there are bound to be repros. shown. So, its worth bearing in mind that the fact that a particular badge is shown pictured on their site should not be taken as an indication that the badge is genuine. From a personal point of view its not a "club" I've ever found the need to join. That said, I can well understand why some do. It would be interesting to hear of their explanation of why they mislead their "members" by showing pictures of "duff" badges without making clear that they were never worn as such.

Dave.

Good thread. I'm glad I saw that page from Dave's book posted above, it answered some questions I had about the development of the badges.
I had previously relied on an article (Police Insignia Collectors Association issue 189/22) which stated:

" Helmets were discontinued in 1907 and replaced by peaked caps, bearing an uncrowned 8 pointed star.

During the 1939-45 war the force was temporarily merged with the RUC. Although it retained its uniform, the badge was changed to include the Kings Crown. The badge is still in use today."

I knew this to be incorrect, as I have images of BHP constables in forage caps wearing the old helmet plate, dating 1909-1921. It is a little hard to see if they are the full 2" (5cm) size rather than the smaller version, but they look fairly large.

What was the source for the commencement date of 1927 for the 1.5" (3.5cm) cap badge version?

Interesting question Pete, but looks like a research project for the answer.
Billyh

HI all, I am presently conducting research for the BHP and have discovered a number of things that may be of interest to those seeking BHP information. According to the research I have discovered four cap badges for the BHP since inception in 1824. 1 - a large eight pointed star with belt and anchor from 1825-90, 2 - belt and anchor from 1890 - 1907, 3 - eight pointed star with belt and anchor 1907 - 1940 & 4 - eight pointed star with belt and anchor from May 1940 until present, this is the badge with the crown upon it. It is an Imperial Crown. I have a copy of the actual report requesting the crown. Also if any body has any old photos of the BHP I would be very grateful to obtain a copy of same. I also have a BHP medal which was instituted in 1946 for gallantry and outstanding service. The gallantry medal has an anchor on the ribbon.

Can I ask where you have obtained this information from. In particular the info. relating to the large 8 pointed star which you date as 1825 to 1890? You say this is a cap badge...

Dave.