British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum
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British & Commonwealth Military Badge Forum (https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/forums/index.php)
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-   -   Colonial Engineers???? (https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=92460)

Britbadge 08-02-23 01:39 AM
Colonial Engineers????
 
1 Attachment(s)
Attachment 279353

engr9266 08-02-23 05:59 AM
Hello, I wonder why you think this is Engineers? Is it because of the motto borrowed from Middle French "honi soit qui mal y pense" (literally “shamed be whoever thinks bad of it” or “shame be to him who thinks evil of it”). which is also a Royal Engineer motto.
As a long time collector of engineer badges I have not come across one like this before.
engr9266

manchesters 08-02-23 10:51 AM
1 Attachment(s)
Lot 1 in Bosleys auction today was a board of Indian Engineers and Sappers & Miners badges.

That badge is on the board, bottom left so thats what it may well be.

regards

mike_vee 08-02-23 11:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by manchesters (Post 596216)
That badge is on the board, bottom left so thats what it may well be.
The badge next to it is described as :

Quote:
Indian Army. 1st Sappers and Miners pagri badge.Good die-stamped brass splayed Prince of Waless plumes with coronet and motto. (Cox 2378)

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Wmr-RHB 08-02-23 04:36 PM
Confused.

As far as I know, the 3rd (and not the 1st) Sappers and Miners used a POW badge as the one to the right (and the one below it).

The 1st Sapper and Miners were from 1906 - 1910 1st Prince of Wales's Own Sappers and Miners. So it could be during those years. From 1910 1st King George's Own Sapper and Miners with crown, cypher GRI and scrolls design.

The badges on the board above these (the strap with the cypher) is from the 2nd Queen's Own Sappers and Miners.

To me it looks as if the whole lower left part of the board (with all the POW badges) is dedicated to the 3rd.

grenadierguardsman 08-02-23 05:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by engr9266 (Post 596205)
Hello, I wonder why you think this is Engineers? Is it because of the motto borrowed from Middle French "honi soit qui mal y pense" (literally “shamed be whoever thinks bad of it” or “shame be to him who thinks evil of it”). which is also a Royal Engineer motto.
As a long time collector of engineer badges I have not come across one like this before.
engr9266
Jerry
I was taught that that motto, was evil be to him who evil thinks.
Andy

JerryBB 08-02-23 05:20 PM
2 Attachment(s)
Interesting, I have these bullion P of W collars, said to have been removed from a board with the description that they were royal Indian Engineers sappers & miners collar badges George Vth.

also arrived today photo of RE with the P of W badge on his sun helmet.

engr9266 08-02-23 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman (Post 596258)
Jerry
I was taught that that motto, was evil be to him who evil thinks.
Andy
Andy, That is what I thought but I put the motto into goggle translation and that is what it came back as....:confused:
Jerry
engr9266

mike_vee 08-02-23 06:05 PM
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wmr-RHB (Post 596245)
Confused.

As far as I know, the 3rd (and not the 1st) Sappers and Miners used a POW badge as the one to the right (and the one below it).

The 1st Sapper and Miners were from 1906 - 1910 1st Prince of Wales's Own Sappers and Miners. So it could be during those years. From 1910 1st King George's Own Sapper and Miners with crown, cypher GRI and scrolls design.

The badges on the board above these (the strap with the cypher) is from the 2nd Queen's Own Sappers and Miners.

To me it looks as if the whole lower left part of the board (with all the POW badges) is dedicated to the 3rd.
Thanks Henk , I copied the info from a dealers site .

I did find this on GMIC forum :

Quote:
Lord Kitchener's Reforms in 1903 saw it redesignated as the '1st Sappers and Miners' which was, again, altered in 1906 to '1st Prince of Wales's Own Sappers and Miners'. On the accession of George V to the throne in 1910 it was renamed '1st King George's Own Sappers and Miners' with the numerical nomination being dropped in 1923.
Also found this button . :confused:

Wmr-RHB 08-02-23 06:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_vee (Post 596266)
Also found this button . :confused:
From 1906 - 1910 ???

See my caption of the information I have (which is of course prone to forwarding errors made by others): Sappers and Miners.

Fatherofthree 08-02-23 06:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by engr9266 (Post 596265)
Andy, That is what I thought but I put the motto into goggle translation and that is what it came back as....:confused:
Jerry
engr9266
Greetings Jerry.

I believe that Google works better than Goggle. :D:D:D

Regards.

Brian

mike_vee 10-02-23 11:50 AM
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Posted this on another thread :

An auction lot show the P of W insignia , badge and button , as being on the "Bengal" unit side (1st Sappers and Miners) . The P of W button is dated 1903-1922.

Note : The display does not show any cap badge for "Bombay" (3rd Sapper and Miners).

https://www.olympiaauctions.com/sale...8/view-lot/28/

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Wmr-RHB 10-02-23 12:33 PM
Alas, on the complete card there is no example of a cap badge for the 3rd. Ima still confused :confused:

mike_vee 10-02-23 01:43 PM
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Not badges but these buttons/card appear to show a possible link. :confused:

1. Bengal Sappers and Miners.

2. First Sappers and Miners.

3. 1st King George's Own Sappers and Miners - Regimental Badge Silk Cigarette Card - 1915

Toby Purcell 10-02-23 02:01 PM
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I believe you’re correct with your interpretation. This badge is believed worn between 1903 and 1910 when the designation changed to King George’s.


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