Identifying an RAF eagle Help Needed
 

Hey :)

Can anybody tell me what the eagle I have circled was and what was it worn for ???

Thanks for any help :)

T X

Looks like an RAF association or veterans pin.

Terry

Ahhh, that is an age old question...

Examples of the badge have been on the market for at least 40 years but there has never been any official explanation of what it is. Some examples seen are clearly modern repros, and I have a very new one with bright finish and enamelled 'RAF'. However, you often see examples that clearly have age, are well made and appear to be original badges, generally in brass.

The only known image that has come to light of anyone wearing one of these is a photograph of a WW1 WRAF, Ruth Theaker. She joined the WRAF in early August 1918 after her husband, who had been wounded in the war returned to duty. She served as a storeswoman at RAF Henlow until being discharged in late 1919. It is uncertain as to what it represents, and its never been officially identified as a WRAF or RAF badge, although Ruth is clearly wearing it with her uniform.

Ohhhhhh

That's definitely it !! :)

Thank you :)

T X

So I was chatting to a friend and he asked could this have been a transition badge between RFC and RAF badge being issued he said he thought he had seen 2 types of badges worn by female RFC staff ???

T X

Hi -I've been a forum member for a little while but this is my first post. I have one of these badges and have also wondered about its origins. I've noticed more than one variation of this badge. The one I have has a gold colored finish applied to it, and vertical lines in the crown. I saw the recent ebay auction where the seller posted the photo of the woman wearing badge. That's the only period photo I've ever seen of the badge in wear.

Here's mine:

Attachment 256796

Attachment 256797

some details
 

I took a few pics of this insignia. It's 5.5 cm wide, has a flat back (except the eagle's body) and 10mm high lugs.
It's not marked.

Adam

A word of warning
 

This badge has been heavy been reproduced for some decades now. I once saw hundreds of these for sale at a fair some years back, I’ve picked up numerous examples overs the years but to be honest how anyone could claim any of them to be original is beyond me.

Very possibly. Years ago I had a cartoon which had originally appeared in some service publication or other around 1919, which showed an Airman with a mixture of uniform and insignia - Navy cap with RAF badge, Army tunic with navy rank etc., drawn to highlight the wide variety of uniform in use between about 1918 and 1920 (unfortunately its been lost and I have forever been on the hunt for it again!).

The Royal Flying Corps and Royal Naval Air Service amalgamated to form the new Royal Air Force (and Women's Royal Air Force) on 1st April 1918. All ranks wore a mixture of uniform and insignia for a while until supplies of the new khaki, and then blue uniforms could be issued to all, and insignia agreed upon. There was a period of 'wearing out' of existing uniform, although the order to officially withdraw khaki for Other Ranks did not come in until July 1924.

Officers were perhaps worse as they were generally not obliged to obtain a new uniform until their current one had worn out (within reason), a problem exacerbated by the introduction of the new light blue RAF uniform from the spring of 1918. It was not compulsory and by the time men had started to begin wearing it (having changed from khaki) it too was abolished in favour of the more familiar blue/grey as of 15th September 1919. The process of wearing out the light blue and obtaining blue/grey for all then began again.

So there may well be badges that were very short lived, never authorised or intended as a form of transitional badge whose origins are not confirmed.

That is very true. This badge has been around for the 40 plus years I have been collecting, and while some are clearly poor reproductions, slightly gaudy, 'tinny' metal, enamelled sweethearts and the like, there are others that are solid, well made, and constructed 'of the period'. Cleary some were worn, but as with a handful of badges here and there, probably the only way to get an authentic one is to find one with provenance and perhaps a photo of it being worn by its original owner. Until then, some of the better ones can be considered 'examples of the type known to have been worn...'

An unidentified and unattributed badge which features in the Martin Marsh repro catalogue. Sounds like another candidate for one of his numerous fantasy pieces.

MM’s wares were often available in different metals, finishes and their quality of strike/casting and materials varies broadly from the very convincing to stereotypical repro end of the spectrum.

Described in the glossary as…
‘480. Royal Air Force wings over the R.A.F. letters.’

Not overly inspiring that he hasn’t even attributed it to a unit or association.

Your 40 mystery may be solved. To use a phrase coined by another member ‘Marshed’.

I wouldnt consider it a fantasy badge when there is photographic evidence of it being worn between 1918 and 1921...

I should also have mentioned for those unfamiliar with his business that well over 90% of the repros in the Martin Marsh Militaria catalogues are from new fake dies made in the 1970s or after.

Out of the thousand or so different badges for sale very few indeed, just a handful, were from original dies which were mostly FN but also a couple Woodward and Gaunt examples.

So mathematically if a badge is from a die appearing in his catalogue it’s the kiss of death viz authenticity.

Do you have such a picture?

Notwithstanding I would certainly be looking for an example from a different die to the one in the Marsh catalogue.

Yes, in the third post of this thread...

If you can say that’s definitely a tablet and it contains the letters R.A.F. you’ve better eyes than me.