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-   -   2nd AIRLANDING ANTI-TANK ARTILLERY:QUESTION (https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7047)

HamandJam 30-07-09 07:04 PM

2nd AIRLANDING ANTI-TANK ARTILLERY:QUESTION
 
4 Attachment(s)
Hi I am new to the forum and I hace a question on the ww2 airborne artillery units.

I have 2 rare shoulder titles one ANTI-TANK ARTILLERY and one RA ANTI-TANK

I believe that both were worn by the 2n Air-Landing Anti-tank battery of the 1st airborne division.

Can any one tell me explain the difference are they from a different time period or otherwise?

Thanks
Jean-Baptiste

54Bty 30-07-09 07:11 PM

Very good question, I have yet to find ANY proof that these were worn by anyone during WWII or post.

HamandJam 30-07-09 07:26 PM

Airborne airlanding artillery
 
Hi

On page 147 of Peter Taylors book you see a picture of a solidier wearing the anti-tank artillery S/T with pegasus and airborne strip

I believe these were anyhow unofficial titles.

Regards

Jean-Baptiste

erracht 31-07-09 03:59 PM

Afraid that (in my humble opinion) the second title (RA ANTI-TANK) is a fake - I've got two of them floating around here somewhere. The first one (ANTI-TANK ARTILLERY) looks better though.

An interesting note here: 223 Bty (from 56 (King's Own) Anti-Tank Regt) wore the title ANTI-TANK BATTERY while with 1st A/B Div 1941-42. Maybe set a precendent for 2nd A/L Regt to follow?

Dean

tynesideirish 31-07-09 04:32 PM

According to the best known 'RA expert' Norman Litchfield ,[Not often wrong] these two RA titles (amongst others) were worn by various RA-AT units not just the Airborne one mentioned. The sad truth is most Airborne forces collections contain these titles that never saw an Airborne BD! They were totally unofficial originating from units serving in India, so you wont find any mention in RA Dress regulations.

The picture mentioned stood beside the Rough Rider* has the AIRBORNE strip under the pegasus. [*Joining 1st ABN July 42 as No.1 AL LAA Bty RA (C of L Yeo) (TA)] This dates that pic from July 42 - May 44 when AIRBORNE flash was removed for the invasion of Europe.
Doubtful that the RA-AT title lasted post invasion.

HamandJam 31-07-09 06:52 PM

Airlanding Battery airborne titles
 
Hi

I my view the RA ANTI-TANK is also genuine, it came from Bosleys, ok this an authority argument but still. Further when you have the badge in your hands you just see and feel it is not fake. There are indeed many fakes of this one around (e.g. on Ebay). It is also not a Pakistani copy which normally have the thick clotted threads.

Thanks for all the info, the fascinating thing of badge collecting is also the research and so little is known and written about them.

Cheers

Jean-Baptiste

peter616 31-07-09 07:34 PM

and also in my view the RA ANTI-TANK is also genuine nice title


peter

peter616 31-07-09 07:58 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Here is the picture of a man wearing the anti-tank artillery S/T with pegasus and airborne strip
and more RA Title

peter

Attachment 15956

Attachment 15957

blackpowder44 01-08-09 01:27 PM

Airborne Flash.
 
I read with interest Tyneside Irish"s post above, especially the latter part saying that the Airborne flash was not worn after May 1944. I thought that this was not correct and on looking through a couple of books found in "Arnhem 1944" by Stephen Badsey a picture of a British officer in conference with some Polish airborne officers carring out an after battle report on the battle of Arnhem. The British officer is definitly wearing an Airborne flash.
Also in the book Arnhem Lift by Louis Hagen there is a picture of him in 1944 wearing the Airborne flash.
I would be interested where Tyneside Irish obtained his info. from. John.

blackpowder44 01-08-09 01:40 PM

Airborne flash
 
Also look at The Glider Soldiers by Alan Wood, Picture showing 5 Glider pilots DFM"s and MM having been decorated by H.M. King George the VI in December 1944. Four of the five Pilots are wearing the Airborne flash. John.

Luc 02-08-09 09:38 PM

The RA anti tank shoulder title is right as rain. I have an identical example in my collection.

As for the airborne flash, there's regulations and practice!
Many Canadian paras and members of the 6th AB div wore the flash after it was officially discontinued.

tynesideirish 03-08-09 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tynesideirish (Post 43835)
The picture mentioned stood beside the Rough Rider* has the AIRBORNE strip under the pegasus. [*Joining 1st ABN July 42 as No.1 AL LAA Bty RA (C of L Yeo) (TA)] This dates that pic from July 42 - May 44 when AIRBORNE flash was removed for the invasion of Europe.
Doubtful that the RA-AT title lasted post invasion.

Sorry. Nowhere in my post above does it mention Glider pilots or anyone other than airborne artillery! This discussion is about RA Anti Tanks and I brought up RA LAA (rough riders) as that photo was mentioned. It is these units that I was talking about regarding removal of the AIRBORNE strip.
My information came from letters in my posession from the Earl of Hardwicke regarding the insignia and roll of the Roughriders and some diaries and photos of members of the 2nd Oban, 300th AT and 3rd AL AT Bty. The Anti tank Bty's where ordered to remove the Airborne strip and they did.

Can we please keep the thread on the subject that it is on and not degenerate into a which units wore Airborne strips after the official order for removal and who didn't thread.

blackpowder44 04-08-09 11:59 AM

airborne strip
 
Dear Tyneside Irish, On reading your previous post the last sentence "This dares the pic from July42-May 44 when the AIRBORNE flash was removed for the invasion of Europe", This sentance seemed to me to imply that all units removed their airborne strip, this is why I queried this statement, if you had made it clear that you were commenting on the specific unit then I would not of made any comment as I have no knowledge of the whys and wherefor of the regulations. I apologise for any upset causet to you. John.

tynesideirish 04-08-09 02:13 PM

John, no problems. It's hard sometimes to convey what we actually mean via these posts. I wasn't specific enough and therefore an honest reply. Mike

54Bty 07-08-09 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tynesideirish (Post 44005)
My information came from letters in my posession from the Earl of Hardwicke regarding the insignia and roll of the Roughriders and some diaries and photos of members of the 2nd Oban, 300th AT and 3rd AL AT Bty. The Anti tank Bty's where ordered to remove the Airborne strip and they did.

So are any members of the above units wearing ANTI-TANK ARTILLERY or R.A. ANTI-TANK?


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