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-   -   Unofficial commissions, factory mistakes and the outright fakes (https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52768)

Mike H 04-04-16 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan O (Post 354372)
An badge that was not authorised for production for the Nortfolk Yeomanry.

It has been suggested that I actually used by Royal parks staff and the like.

Firmin maker's mark.

Die cast reverse.

The Norfolk Yeomanry badge is squatter and the crown far smaller with fatter letters

Alan O 04-04-16 07:06 PM

1 Attachment(s)
In brass like this one.

Mike H 04-04-16 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan O (Post 354402)
In brass like this one.

Yes, in gold anodised. Not sure on the maker off the top of my head

William 05-04-16 08:54 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Although these images have been posted before, possibly you might also be interested to see this ...

engr9266 05-04-16 10:31 AM

All silver RLC
 
1 Attachment(s)
There is a R.L.C. ALL silver anodised badge produced in Hong Kong for use there until the correct badges were made available.

Mike H 05-04-16 01:30 PM

The Suffolks badges are from the same stable as the E.Yorks,Beds and Herts etc.

KLR 05-04-16 08:20 PM

I can add a couple of examples from the King's Regt - and corroborated from Chris's book or discussions with him.

It is well known that the WO (which became MoD in 1964) authorised the eventual production in the 1950s but most were produced much later. For example an AA version of the 1950 Pattern King's badge did not actually appear until after 1959. The CCN for that year indicates that it was not yet available. It was not, therefore, worn by the pre amalgamation regiment. There is a seeded scroll version of the AA but I have not yet found the date of its introduction. Chris has some evidence that the seedless scroll version appeared in about 1964 - this is the badge still used by the LUOTC.

I was once offered an all gold AA King's badge with the explanation of it being a 'bandsman's badge' !!! - absolute rubbish, it was merely a production mistake.

The other example was the Liverpool Scottish (Cameron type) AA badge for which Pattern Cards exist dated 1965. Though this was an official production the unit refused to wear it. They survived until disbandment in 1967 with old WM versions (some purportedly made in Pakistan) and the AA version was only ever afterwards worn by cadets.

fougasse1940 06-04-16 07:30 PM

2 Attachment(s)
South Staffordshire - unmarked slider
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan O (Post 354370)
An unofficial commission of a badge that was authorised for production.

No maker's mark.

Die struck reverse.

Bought from 5 from Jeremy Tenniswood in 2005. he had a box of them

This one, equally unofficial, has a different reverse die.

Rgds, Thomas.

Mike H 07-04-16 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fougasse1940 (Post 354704)
South Staffordshire - unmarked slider

This one, equally unofficial, has a different reverse die.

Rgds, Thomas.

There is a believed genuine badge to the South Staffs. Firmin London marked with an unseeded scroll.

bess55 07-04-16 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike H (Post 354850)
There is a believed genuine badge to the South Staffs. Firmin London marked with an unseeded scroll.

Mike,
I have a Firmin London marked S.Staffs A/A cap badge with a glued on shaped piece of brown Holland on the rear - quite correctly. The slider appears slightly over long and retains the gold anodising. Non seeded scroll and clear signs of wear on the front and neck of the slider.

I have 2 different die versions of this badge (which differ again from the above) with unmarked sliders. Both are seeded on the scroll. One has a very neatly made Holland oval backing glued on also.

Regards all

Bess

William 08-04-16 02:25 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike H (Post 354850)
There is a believed genuine badge to the South Staffs. Firmin London marked with an unseeded scroll.

Possibly this is the badge you refer to, Mike.

All the best

William

Mike H 08-04-16 08:51 AM

Thats the one William. Middlesex is falls into a similar category as this.

Jimbo66 24-04-16 09:33 AM

9th Lancers
 
Hi Alan,

I bought my 9th Lancers badge from John Gaylor, who was then Secretary of the Military Historical Society. At the time John was the only 'dealer' who could obtain modern badges so it seems logical that he had access to someone at Gaunt's or Firmin's who was prepared to make these badges. I think we have to accept that they are not 'genuine' issued badges but for all intents and purposes are an example.

Regards,

Jim

hagwalther 25-04-16 04:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimbo66 (Post 357291)
Hi Alan,

I bought my 9th Lancers badge from John Gaylor, who was then Secretary of the Military Historical Society. At the time John was the only 'dealer' who could obtain modern badges so it seems logical that he had access to someone at Gaunt's or Firmin's who was prepared to make these badges. I think we have to accept that they are not 'genuine' issued badges but for all intents and purposes are an example.

Regards,

Jim

Hi Guys,

I agree with everything stated above apart from the Firmin bit.

Gaunt was the manufacturer of his badges - check out the sliders used.

I wonder what else he was 'involved in'...

Regards

Chris

didithevan 20-05-16 07:53 PM

Erm, I have one of these HLI badges and to throw a spanner in the works. I got it off of the shelf in shed D2 at COD Bicester in 1983 during a stock reconciliation task. They were obsolescent and marked for disposal so I had one (I was a kid at the time and knew little about badges or I would have half inched the other 7 or so on the shelf!). So I don't know know about unauthorised, but having a part number, being held in the Army depot and me getting it from there sort of makes it official to me. I did also let Chris know about this when I contacted him about another supposed fake - the Gordons with BY DAND instead of BYDAND, again I got mine off the shelf in the depot.


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