Auction items

[54Bty]

Really nice pieces, if the bidding is anything to go by!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WW2-PAIR-OF-PE...QQcmdZViewItem

[JON188]

However some bits from this source are very dubious, having been placed on as original, and not being.

[54Bty]

Originally Posted by JON188

However some bits from this source are very dubious, having been placed on as original, and not being.

Have you looked at the items?

If not look here first:

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...pictureid=3203

21st Para Bn never had a printed title and all the ones i no of, are all woven
so some one it for a big ------------


peter

[Jibba Jabba]

Bit of a cheek putting your name on a duff item Peter.

[Alan O]

Petehal is a very well known ebay seller and is often mentioned on other forums as a man with a limitless supply of rare badges. Enough said.

Alan

[oc14]

I have sent this member many emails regading the fake tat that he pollutes collections with. I have had some really quite nasty replies - I really don't think that he cares that he is selling what he knows to be fakes.
If anyone is interested, these same items can be bought (from the same source as this seller buys his - ready aged !) from a chap by the name of "Martin" who sells at Doncaster Market (Wednesday), Chesterfield (Thursday) or Retford (Friday) for a fraction of the price.

Please can more members (would be particularly good if Peter could contact him) contact him to inform him that the items are fake.

It is in everyones interest to stamp out this fake junk. Once one of these fake items is added to your collection then it casts doubt on everything else in that collection.

Just my two pennyworth !

OC14

[pethal]

I joined the forum on reccomendation from a member, I am an ex-vet and obviously not to bright. After viewing the general area on fakes, I suddenly feel it is a very vunerable area to be selling on eBay. I would never attempt to sell something as genuine, if I had any inclination that it was repro: or fake, in any case I apologise to any recipient. Anything can be returned in the 14 day grace period, and monies paid will be refunded without question if assumed to be incorrect. This as always been my policy. Total of four items returned in the last five years and payments returned. (within grace period)
The items which I wish to specificaly refer too, which fetched astronomical figures to a totaly unknown bidder, whom I do not expect ever to honor his debts (Pegasus patches and 21st S/T) and in the end land me with a negative. I guess a total scam ???.The genuine bid was from a very nice gentleman who was gutted on losing the bid. This gentleman had gone to the trouble of contacting me to request photo's of the rear with the khaki lifted, I obliged as always, he needed to see the thru print on the rear which confirms they are not copies. If I ever had to gamble on these being correct I would have willingy done it.
Thanks for your time, I do not hope to be appearing again here.
pethal.

[rubicon]

Dear Pethal,
As far as I am concerned you can go back to your nasty business on evilbay. For few years I have observed what you are selling as original items on the famous bid website, I state probably all the embroidered patches or cloth titles you sold are fakes, most coming from Pakistan. The printed patches and titles you are selling are made from a color lazer printer and you or other try to make them as worn or used condition to mislead buyers.
Your "reputation" is now known in Europe and over the Atlantic and you can be sure I shall do emphasize it
J-F

[oc14]

Originally Posted by pethal

I joined the forum on reccomendation from a member, I am an ex-vet and obviously not to bright. After viewing the general area on fakes, I suddenly feel it is a very vunerable area to be selling on eBay. I would never attempt to sell something as genuine, if I had any inclination that it was repro: or fake, in any case I apologise to any recipient. Anything can be returned in the 14 day grace period, and monies paid will be refunded without question if assumed to be incorrect. This as always been my policy. Total of four items returned in the last five years and payments returned. (within grace period)
The items which I wish to specificaly refer too, which fetched astronomical figures to a totaly unknown bidder, whom I do not expect ever to honor his debts (Pegasus patches and 21st S/T) and in the end land me with a negative. I guess a total scam ???.The genuine bid was from a very nice gentleman who was gutted on losing the bid. This gentleman had gone to the trouble of contacting me to request photo's of the rear with the khaki lifted, I obliged as always, he needed to see the thru print on the rear which confirms they are not copies. If I ever had to gamble on these being correct I would have willingy done it.
Thanks for your time, I do not hope to be appearing again here.
pethal.

A few points here Peter:-
1) I am the forum member who , being fed up to the back teeth with your dishonesty, pointed you in the direction of this forum so that you could see that my views of your dealings are not personal but that a number of others have also noted that you are not above selling fakes as originals.
2) You say you an "ex-vet" - is that an Ex Veteran (you cannot be an ex vet unless you have stopped being a veteran ????) or do you mean that you were formerly a Veterinary Surgeon (given the standard of your spelling I suspect that this is not what you meant).
3) You still maintain that the items you are offering are genuine EVEN THOUGH THE ACKNOWLEDGED SUBJECT EXPERT (PETER616) WHOSE BOOK YOU RELY ON SO MUCH - STATES THAT THEY ARE FAKE !
4) You state that you would not offer any items for auction if you had even an inkling that they were fake - what about all those emails that I and others have sent you over the years notifying you that the items you offer are fake ? Or would you prefer to take the word of that famous badge expert "Martin" ?
5) Total of four items returned in the last five years ? Well done, you have managed to con hundreds of people during that time ! If an item is genuine then it is genuine forever - if it is fake then it also follows that it is fake forever and not just for a 14 day grace period ! If you had any decency about you, you would offer a no obligation refund to ANYONE who has bought from you in the last 5 years. Suggest you then take them to "Martin" for a refund from him too !
6) You seem offended to have been the subject of a scam in connection with the fake 21st Para title and Pegasus patches and talk about the bidder failing to honor (your spelling - and I know that you are not American). Hello - pot ? kettle ? black ?
7) All of this still didn't lead to you ending the listing of the fake pathfinder wing that you sold today for £52 plus postage.
8) I am still amazed that you appeared here and tried to defend your actions - sadly you failed and have only confirmed what a dishonest and greedy person you are.

Please come back and visit the forum again soon to try and convince us why we should believe you....oh and could you bring the cab driver with you too next time !

OC14

[ard-ri]

It would appear that there a few here who are not above the crime of lynching if given the chance. While selling fakes as original is a despicable act, it is also the responsibility of the purchaser to have enough knowledge to avoid spending in excess of 200 pounds on a fake. To be perfectly blunt. If you don't know what the hell you are doing and are taken in by someone selling fakes, you have no one to blame but yourself. I am totally sick and tired of people not taking responsibility for their mistakes or lack of knowledge. I have from time to time been taken in by a fake. I have never once whined about it. Take responsibility for your lack of knowledge and stop crying. Jesus Christ, some of you sound like a bunch of Zealots. I am not defending this seller, I am just tired of listening to the pissing and moaning. I have been visiting this forum less and less due to the crying going on. This hobby is not life and death, it is a hobby, and if you are risking good money in the hope that investing in said badges will bring you a profit at some point in time, who is the greedy one?. I am curious which of you who have attacked this seller would do so in person with the chance you may get your teeth knocked down your throat. Are we adults here or high school children?. Civility is a virtue. If you are able to afford exorbitant prices on a badge, you obviously have more money than knowledge.

Michael

[ard-ri]

Correct me if I am missing something, but at no point does the seller seem to state that these items are "Original".

Michael

[hagwalther]

Guys, Ard-Ri is right and if you don't want to get ripped off you need to devise a strategy to prevent this sort of thing happening.

You need to try collecting German combat badges if you need to get burnt with fakes but what you do to resolve the issue is to ensure that before you spend money you get advice from those more knowledgable than you. This can be via site like this or personal correspondance with known experts in the field you are collecting in.

BUT

To get this advice you will need proper images of obverse, reverse and also side (edge) views before any help can be given.

You cannot usually tell from crappy eBay photos or those where details have been washed out by over exposure to light or flash. If you can't get proper scanned images up to say 800 dpi or excellent photos taken in natural light then all I can say is pass on the item - simple as that.

At the risk of alienating myself from the entire forum here I will go on to say that it would be better for all members if a bit of money was spent on a quality DEDICATED scanner (NOT THE THREE IN ONE TYPES WITH PRINTER, FAX etc) which has a professional mode setting and good depth of field characteristics.

To be in the collecting game you really need good gear and in my opinion a dedicated scanner is ESSENTIAL.

These scanners do cost a few bob but compared to most badges of the quality members here collect are a drop in the ocean. They also take better magnified images than most cameras can and have the added advantage of being consistent. They can magnify up to massive (and I mean massive) resolution where a small area can be checked for specific die flaws or even stitching holes with ease where a known die flaw, thread used etc. shows genuine or fake.

I do not like fakers at all (believe me on this) but because people like this exist you have to protect yourself with a good purchasing strategy such as:

a) Insist on quality images from the vendor even if he is selling on eBay get new images send directly to your own email address.
b) Insist on life time guarantee of authenticity.
c) Insist on a 30 day evaluation period (at least) to check out quality (as opposed to authenticity).
d) If you can, buy from known sources of quality items.

If you don't get a suitable result from a), b) and c) above then drop out of the transaction there and then - simple as that.

If however, all looks good put the scans of the badge up on the forum here BEFORE parting with money for your peers to re-check the item if you are not confident of doing it yourself. But remember, they will need quality scans to do this task or they will be unable to help you.

I have been asked a few time re: autheticity of anodised badges (believe me I'm no expert here but am learning) but often the images are of such poor quality I can't even begin to help and have to resort to written instruction in what to look for which can be a bit hit and miss depending on if the instructions are understood and followed correctly.

Still, if your peers give the go ahead then purchase the badge and when it arrives:

a) Scan the badge again with your nice new scanner.
b) Post the scans here and get a further peer review.
d) Use your gut feeling.

If all OK then you have enlarged your collection else get your money back using the right of return previously negotiated. If this turns to crap then inform the seller that you intend to expose the them on a collecting forum but give them the right of return to respond. This usually sorts things out before you have to get into 'toxic mode' exposing the seller and then having to start chasing your money via other methods.

As time progresses you will start to work out what is good and bad but even these days I still ask for opionions on 90% of what I buy in the German combat badge area and have not been disappointed for many a year and as such, have not had to plan any lynchings of those who are of dubious sales character.

Regards

Chris

[pethal]

I could not agree more, unfortunately it was a WW2 one. I started work on the farm at ten years of age so you will appreciate that was not good for my schooling.
I will not be visiting again, but had to make this call to point out that "For King and Country" by Harlan Glenn page 110 does state there where both printed and embroidered titles issued.
Bye.