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#31
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This link will take you to the newsreel footage, detail is at about 19 seconds in.... http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=5155 Regards Steve |
#32
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Hi Chaps,
I regret I cannot add to the careful research and discussion presented thus far by Brent and others, except to post my pictures. Hopefully more photographs of Frontiersmen will come to light. Cheers, Tinto |
#33
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I've read that the enameled one's were for the association members post war. Anyone confirm this as I was just about to but one thought better of it.
Simon. |
#34
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Hi All,
I looked back into my records. Here is a response to my query re these two badges: "Hi, My opinion is that the badge on the left is probably the badge of the short-lived Independent Overseas Legion of Frontiersmen aka Imperial Overseas Legion of Frontiersmen which broke away c1927 and was brought back into the fold in 1934. As to the brighter badge on the right, it is believed, but not proved, that some years later an entrepreneur had quite a number of these struck as reproductions. I have seen these offered for sale with various claims regarding provenance as high as £UK125, which puts an extraordinary value on a non-military badge. It has often been believed that this was the officers badge of the 25th (Service) Battalion Royal Fusiliers (Frontiersmen) who served in East Africa 1915-1917, but in fact the officers badge bore little or no difference to the o.r.s due to the speed with which the unit was raised and some badges were also struck locally in East Africa. I have to admit that in early issues of my own "One Hundred Years of the Legion of Frontiersmen" (Phillimore 2004), due to an editorial error which I missed, the badge is incorrectly described as a 25th RF officers badge. If you care to look at the history website www.frontiersmenhistorian.info from early December on the Topic page for Dec/Jan you will find more on the IOC breakaway under the heading of "The Frontiersman who wrote to the King". My latest book "Outrider of Empire" (University of Alberta Press 2008) has more on the subject. Geoff Pocock (UK Historian and archivist)" Cheers, Tinto |
#35
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garage badge
just out of interest are there any contemporary photos show the 'garage badge' being worn.
Bob |
#36
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Hi Guys,
great to see this thread taking off again,with some new info,etc. It seems that others have experienced the same difficulties I had with LOF contact, info & research ? Still, we move on & fill in the gaps ! The "patterns" quoted ,were origionally suggested for ease of reference, nothing 'official' intended here. More,later. Cheers ! Steve (NZ) |
#37
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Bob
Images of the "2nd & 3rd Patterns" being worn by 25th RF men exist but I've not come across any photo showing the "1st Pattern" garage version. I live in hope . My terminology of 2nd & 3rd patterns is again referenced to the images in Westlake's book although only the 2nd pattern has a K&K reference (1143). Like Steve (NZ) I find it easier to reference them in this manner. Regards Steve |
#38
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Tinto, it has been far to long since we last collaborated on a badge mystery.
I didn’t realise until your post that it was Geoff Pocock (No relation to Roger Pocock) you made your inquiry with. I suspect that Geoff who is one of the four main LOF historians, passed your request on to Bruce Fuller who was probably the one who supplied the information, I only say this because it was Bruce who forwarded your photos to me. From what I am hearing it seems the New Zealand badge book writers are not alone in getting it wrong when it comes to Frontiersmen badges. Tinto, you might be interested to know I have put together a blog on the history of NZVC badges and posted it on the NZMR web site, when I get around to finishing it I will post some extracts on this forum. Cheers Brent |
#39
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Hi Brent,
Good to hear from you. As far as I know, Geoff Pocock made that reply (as in my previous post) before he sent copies of my query and pictures to Dean Bruckshaw and Bruce Fuller. I did correspond briefly with Bruce after that, mainly about the small lapel badges. I look forward to seeing what you have been up to on your blog. Best wishes, Tinto |
#40
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I have communicated with four NZ based LOF researchers/historians, when I asked the badge question, three of them could supply me with nothing that I didn’t already know, the fourth however has provided me with a wealth of information to help me in my research and understanding of the LOF. But in saying that all four were very generous in supplying pre 1953 photographs showing NZ Frontiersmen in uniform. From these photographs alone I now have a very good record of the variates of badges that were worn by the NZ LOF. Tinto’s reply from Geoff Pocock and his comments in his 3rd post is evidence that there are LOF researchers/historians that share our passion for badges and are only to willing to provide an answer when questioned. (And photos when asked for) Heres a photo I found on the net, I couldn’t understand the lingo, but definitely looks like a “regulation” 25th Battalion badge to me. |
#41
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if the anecdote was local blacksmiths shop or farriers it would be more believeable. if evidence can be found it might shed light on the tf badges with the scroll blanked out by the same machine. Bob |
#42
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What is unusual about the homemade badge is that it was supposedly a modified Gren Gds badge. However it is not made up of the sealed pattern Gren Gds badge with lugs and 17 flame tips but the rare slidered 14 flame tips version.
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#43
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#44
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IMO the design of the badge that was decided on by the officer’s of the 25th Battalion (City of London Regiment) Royal Fusiliers, and submitted to the King for approval as the Battalions regulation badge, was most likely copied from the pattern of badge that was worn by the Royal Fusiliers (City of London Regiment).
Brent |
#45
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