WM & GM Buttons

[Rob Miller]

Other ranks General Service Pattern buttons come in gilding metal for regular infantry battalions and white metal presumably for volunteer battalions in both QVC & KC.

But has anyone ever seen a white metal Devonshire Regiment Button for use by Officers?

[Peter Brydon]

Officers Volunteer and V.B.buttons ( if they existed for the Devons ) would presumably have been silver or silver plated,that was certainly true in the case of the Kings Liverpools Regt ( in the case of those battalions which did not have their own design of button ).

P.B.

[Rob Miller]

There doesn't seem to be any definite rule though, some volunteer battalions used wm versions of the standard regular button, others had their own special buttons locally made. Howard Ripley & Denis Darmanins excellent book shows a lot of examples, but sadly doesn't give the whole story.

Perhaps if anyone has any unrecorded VB buttons they could post them here.

Here is a 2nd VB Duke of Cornwall L I.

[RMR]

I do not know if this is unrecorded as I have no books on buttons but it's a volunteers button.

[Peter Brydon]

Pictures of the buttons of the 1st and 2nd V.B.`s Kings Liverpool attached.


Also a picture of an officers quality General Service pattern QVC silvered with copper showing through on highlights.Fixed shank and made by W.Dowler and marked Superior Quality.This is one of only a few I have seen.Worn by Volunteer officers who`s units did not have a regimental button design perhaps ?

P.B.

[CftD]

Originally Posted by Rob Miller

There doesn't seem to be any definite rule though, some volunteer battalions used wm versions of the standard regular button, others had their own special buttons locally made. Howard Ripley & Denis Darmanins excellent book shows a lot of examples, but sadly doesn't give the whole story.

Perhaps if anyone has any unrecorded VB buttons they could post them here.

Here is a 2nd VB Duke of Cornwall L I.

The issue of white metal and/or silver plated buttons is a complex one. Most units were Rifle Volunteers, of course. Pre 1885, the funding of items such as buttons was haphazard and often dependant upon the wealth of individual units, particularly their officers (to fund such items). The closer you get back to 1859, the more units you find where officers and other ranks wore the same button, whether horn, blackened brass or white metal. As you move on, more central funding became available and distinctions emerged between officers and other ranks buttons in terms of quality. Post 1885, of course, the distinctions were established but even so, some regiments (they were now Volunteer Bns. of line infantry regiments) chose very specific Bn. buttons whilst others settled for silver plate/white metal copies of the Regular Bn. button. There were added distinctions with the omission of battle honours in some cases and not in others. And don't forget the Militia Bns., who often wore silver plate/white metal. The subject needs to be approached regiment by regiment, working back from 1908 without making the mistake of assuming that all regiments/Bns. followed the same pattern, which they clearly did not - that is what makes the subject so fascinating.

[janner305]

Fascinating thread,

I've added a few more examples of Volunteer Battalion buttons that I have come across. Some of them are quite common, but there are some rarer ones amongst them.
I also had images of the 3rd Volunteer Battalion The Devonshire Regt, both QVC and KC and also the 3rd Volunteer Battalion The Gloucestershire Regt, but my attachment was over the allowed file size.
Have also seen a Highland Light Infantry 1st Volunteer Battalion in my travels, but couldn't afford it!!
Had never realised that the DCLI had its own dedicated 2nd Volunteer Battalion button.
Will need to be more observant in the future.

Janner305

[janner305]

Addendum to my earlier post. Have realized that the Suffolk Battalion button offered as a volunteer battalion button is in fact a 3rd Admin Battalion, Suffolk Rifle Volunteers button. Sorry for the error. I have also included images of the 2 other buttons mentioned, 3rd Vol Battn Devon Regt & 3rd Vol Battn Gloucestershire Regt.

Janner305

[Rob Miller]

A new purchase, a 25mm horn button which I assume is Volunteers.

The wreath appears to be Oak leaves & Acorns so I assume it English rather than Scottish.

All the following are listed in Howard Ripley and Dennis Darmanin books as having a unit numbered 23rd, but the last 3 have a button shown with a different design, so this button could have been worn by one or more of the following units?

All comments welcome, Rob

Cheshire, Weaverham
Derbyshire, Glossop
Devonshire, Chudleigh
Essex, Maldon
Hampshire, Cosham
Kent, Penshurst
Norfolk, Downham Mkt
Somersetshire, Wincanton
Staffordshire, Wolverhampton
Yorkshire (West Riding), Burley

Lancashire, Ashton-u-L
Middlesex, Inns of Court
Surrey, Rotherhithe

[janner305]

Hi Rob,

This button looks suspiciously like the 1885-1901 black horn button to the 23rd Regiment Bombay (Light) Infantry. It is shown in Vol 7 of Poulsom's "Buttons of the Indian Army", Vol 7 being the additions & errata volume. The 23rd Regiment (Light) Infantry buttons are shown in Vol 4 page 50/51, but this black horn button is not shown there, hence its inclusion in Vol 7.

Regards

Janner305

[Rob Miller]

Thanks for your reply Janner.

I don't have any books on Indian buttons but you could be right, is the Oak wreath common in India?

Regards
Rob

[Rob Miller]

Going back to my original post, I have now found a few WM Devonshire buttons, some are better quality than the others.

So do these represent Officers and other ranks buttons from a Devonshire Volunteer Battalion or are they Militia?

Rob

[Cribyn]

Hello Rob

I would say that you have acquired buttons for both officers and other ranks for a Volunteer Battalion. It's not unusual to find varying quality buttons for the same rank from roughly the same period.

Some nice buttons there.

Roger