Army Apprentice Maker Mark

[jeep]

Every AA AAS cap badge I have ever seen (and I've seen a lot) has had the maker mark 'J.R. GAUNT LONDON.' I found this one the other day marked 'J.R. GAUNT B'HAM'. As the badge was last worn in 1966 I suspect this B'Ham mark to be a repro? The tooling used produces identical badges, but the colouration does differ (which did happen with different batches). Also the bottom of the slider is not rounded, something I have seen before but on FIRMIN badges.
K&K does not list a gold coloured QC badge, only the GM version and silver anodised. Oddly, all GM QC badges that I have seen have been marked 'J.R. GAUNT B'HAM'.
Until now I had not questioned maker marks, but this has got me thinking.
Any observations, and all comments gratefully received.

[wright241]

Originally Posted by jeep

Every AA AAS cap badge I have ever seen (and I've seen a lot) has had the maker mark 'J.R. GAUNT LONDON.' I found this one the other day marked 'J.R. GAUNT B'HAM'. As the badge was last worn in 1966 I suspect this B'Ham mark to be a repro? The tooling used produces identical badges, but the colouration does differ (which did happen with different batches). Also the bottom of the slider is not rounded, something I have seen before but on FIRMIN badges.
K&K does not list a gold coloured QC badge, only the GM version and silver anodised. Oddly, all GM QC badges that I have seen have been marked 'J.R. GAUNT B'HAM'.
Until now I had not questioned maker marks, but this has got me thinking.
Any observations, and all comments gratefully received.

Jeep, I can recall that at least one of the ones issued to me was slightly more gold-like than silver. I also remember (as you have mentioned) the one fitted on the No2 dress cap as being more silver-like than the one I wore on the beret. David

[2747andy]

John,
the B'Ham mark on Anodised badges is absolutely fine, it is just the metal ones you need worry about (I know AA is a metal too)! I think you'll find the Apprentices badge was worn for quite some time post 1966?

Andy

[wright241]

Originally Posted by 2747andy

John,
the B'Ham mark on Anodised badges is absolutely fine, it is just the metal ones you need worry about (I know AA is a metal too)! I think you'll find the Apprentices badge was worn for quite some time post 1966?

Andy

Yes indeed. It was definitely being worn in 66 and possibly a few years beyond that if my memory serves me well.

[2747andy]

I remember visiting Chepstow in the late 1970's and it was still in wear then!

Andy

[wright241]

I was going to mention that my brother left Arborfield about 5 years after I left in 66 and I think he was still wearing it - although I know that at one point he was wearing the REME badge, but I can't remember when.

[Mike H]

The gold and the silver versions I have in my collection are both marked Gaunt London

[jeep]

Gentlemen. I appreciate that the 'B'HAM' mark is valid for AA badges, I just feel uneasy that it is on this badge. Also, Andy's point that the same mark is suspect on GM badges also raises alarms. If K&K is correct and the QC badge was struck in GM, what, if any MM would it have had? I say again, I have never seen a QC GM badge with anything other than 'GAUNT B'HAM'.
Regarding dates, I refer you to this thread I posted some time ago.
http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...ead.php?t=4809 post 7.
For Apprentice Schools the control passed in 1965 and the title was changed from 'School' to 'Collage' and the subsequent acceptance of parent corps badges; Chepstow RE, Harrogate R. Signals, Arborfield and Carlisle REME. I cannot dispute that the badge WAS NOT worn post 1966/7, but I find it hard to believe given the time line of events.

[2747andy]

John,
see this thread, it might explain a few points;

http://www.britishbadgeforum.com/for...ad.php?t=34586

Andy

[jeep]

was going to mention that my brother left Arborfield about 5 years after I left in 66 and I think he was still wearing it - although I know that at one point he was wearing the REME badge, but I can't remember when.

At Arborfield, (cannot vouch for the other schools) the re-badging parade from AAS to REME was held in 1966. The AAS badge was then redundant. I passed out in December 1964, and we were aware of the impending change. During that last 'term' all AAS items were withdrawn and Corps items issued, so you passed out as a Corps member and not as an apprentice.

[2747andy]

Mike,
if what you say is correct and the Apprentices badge went out of wear in 1966, then it just add strength to the Gm badges marked B'Ham as repros! Chris Marsh has identified that Gaunt appear to be the only known manufactures of the cap badges but it is strange that if they went out of wear in 66 that there are B'Ham marked anodised badges?

I'm pretty sure I've a Gm Gaunt London badge somewhere, probably will not be until the weekend at the earliest that I unearth it?

Andy

[fougasse1940]

The maker mark looks engraved instead of stamped, in that case it is a fake.

Rgds, Thomas.

[hagwalther]

Hi Guys,

Difficult to tell from the images but the slider appears to be the:

6.9: 'Step' variant (see page 70) with a maker mark that looks like it is the:

6.1: J.R.GAUNT B’HAM (see page 49).

Note that the slider is missing the sharply defined 'Step' but there looks like a tell tale sign of one there.

The mark appears to have been lightly struck.

I doubt if anyone would try and copy a common badge such as this.

Regards

Chris

[grey_green_acorn]

It is also possible, even though the badge was no longer being worn from the late 1960s, but before it was officially notified as obsolete, that the stores system was running low on stocks and reordered the badge from Gaunt resulting in the B'ham mark appearing!

Tim