20th Hussars - Good from the bad?

[Jibba Jabba]

Has anyone got in their collections a genuine 20th Hussars badge? I am sure this badge has to be one of the hardest badges to identify as original. I have noted two types one with the circular O and the O that is more oval. The reproductions do appear to have very neatly soldered sliders.

I had explored the possibility that genuine badges might not be sharp on the reverse, however I then bought a genuine collar dog which I knew to be one hundred percent genuine and that was very sharp. So much for that idea.

All help is very much appreciated. Thank you.

This is a badge I believe to be fake is has the oval O however all the repro examples on eBay have the round O. So there must be fakes of both types.

[Malcolm Davey]

JJ
I will post a picture of mine later when i get time which i think is genuine.

Malc

[wright241]

I have an officers silver marked example - do you want pictures?
David

[Jibba Jabba]

Hi Dave,

I`m really looking for pictures of the OR all brass badge from collections. I believe there is also a NCO's cap badge with white metal X's as I have photographs taken in 1910 of this badge ar Scarborough. This was my great uncles first regiment which is why I`m interested.

For those posting the OR badge I would like to know if their badges feels sharp on the reverse where the die has left the edge of the X's. Also if their badge has a crimp line on the slider.

[wright241]

I'll see what I have got this evening. I might have a brass one - although now, I am not sure whether its genuine or not...
Will get back to you tomorrow. David

[wright241]

This is one - which I believe to be genuine - with a slider and JR Gaunts mark on it. David

[wright241]

Heres the front. David

[wright241]

Do I assume that as mine has an oval O - even with the makers mark on the slider - that it is a fake? David
(I am referring to the 2 pictures of the badge I sent earlier).

[Alan O]

David,

I am afraid that mark is a fake. Gaunts did not use that particular style and font and did not mark their ORs badges until WW2 and even then only a few. That particular mark with the full stop is typically found on Ebay fakes such as those sold by Taxicar and other sellers of repro.

Sorry but I am quite certain that it is a wrong one.

Alan

[wright241]

Originally Posted by Alan Owen

David,

I am afraid that mark is a fake. Gaunts did not use that particular style and font and did not mark their ORs badges until WW2 and even then only a few. That particular mark with the full stop is typically found on Ebay fakes such as those sold by Taxicar and other sellers of repro.

Sorry but I am quite certain that it is a wrong one.

Alan

aaaaaaahhhhhh - so the gaunts is a fake. ok. Does that mean the silver marked one is as well?

David

[Alan O]

I have never heard of a silver version outside of a repro catalogue I am afraid.
They have been sold on ebay as an NCO's badge but it was by an unscrupulous seller who I would not trust.

Alan

[Saddle tree maker]

IMO the 20H kings crown pattern badge should only be made in either Gilt, Bronze or Brass. Any white-metal badge IMO is a fake.
However, I will not dismiss out of hand JJ's claim of a bi-metal one and would be very interested in seeing the pictures of this badge.
STM.

[wright241]

Originally Posted by Alan Owen

I have never heard of a silver version outside of a repro catalogue I am afraid.
They have been sold on ebay as an NCO's badge but it was by an unscrupulous seller who I would not trust.

Alan

Alan,
Thanks for the info. I can see that the only way I am going to find out whether what I have is good or not is when I send them all to auction.
As I have hundreds, I don't suppose you are aware of an "organisation" that will do this - so that I can clear out any rubbish now? I remember hand-carrying some stuff to Wallis&Wallis down in Hove many years ago, but as far as I am aware, they don't do this anymore.
What "we" need is a reference book on re-strikes/copies, isn't it...

Rgds, David

[Jibba Jabba]

Wise words STM. See the NCO badge to the far left. I have included two OR's to prove that this is not a trick of camera exposure.

[Saddle tree maker]

JJ,
I think the badge being worn by the NCO is indeed the normal other rank's badge in brass.
The picture below of a 'T' shoulder title if seen at some distance on the shoulder of an old soldier in a black and white photograph, would lead many to believe that it was bi/metal.
I feel strongly that old photographs are very important when discovering what patterns of badges were worn, but I'm not so sure they can be used to distinguish what type of metal they were made from.
If we look closely at the picture, the NCO's badge appears to have brass numerals with a white/metal crown, but then on that basis the 2 lads next to him would appear to be wearing white/metal badges. I believe all three are brass.
All it took to produce the effect below was a slight bend between the T and the 8 and as we know the 20H's badge is notorious for bending (and breaking) at the point between crown and numeral's.
I'm personally not convinced, sorry.
STM.