Coldstream Guards badges

[Toby Purcell]

Yes, there is no doubt that the cartouche badge was in form and function the conception of later head dress badges right through to today.

[leigh kitchen]

Originally Posted by Toby Purcell

That last one is questionable/debatable. Given that it's before Waterloo I can only assume that it is depicting a man of the Grenadier, right flank company. To my knowledge there is no evidence that Grenadier or Light company soldiers had different cartouche pouch badges to the centre companies. Dress was different, but my understanding is that that was confined to a device added to the shako plate and a white plume. I will be interested to know what others can add.

The seated figure has a white over red plume in his shako so he'll be Centre Company rather than Grenadier Company, it looks like the artist isn't thinking of the grenade for the Grenadier Company but for all.
Am I right in thinking that the shako portrayed is a Belgic rather than a stove pipe? In which case the scene will be set at Waterloo.

[leigh kitchen]

Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman

So we can see that these devices from 1704 eventually made their way on to the Waterloo Shako over 100 years later.
Andy

You mean as a design or device on the shako plate rather than as the star "shape" itself as the plate?

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by leigh kitchen

The seated figure has a white over red plume in his shako so he'll be Centre Company rather than Grenadier Company, it looks like the artist isn't thinking of the grenade for the Grenadier Company but for all.
Am I right in thinking that the shako portrayed is a Belgic rather than a stove pipe? In which case the scene will be set at Waterloo.

Yes, I believe it is Belgic. Perhaps the cartouche is just meant as debris and detritus, I seem to recall that the Grenadiers of the Imperial Guard did have such a grenade device on their cartouche pouches. I am fairly sure that the British Foot Guards did not.

[leigh kitchen]

The pouch does appear to be "just sitting there", not attached to a belt.
It may be mentioned in the illustration's caption.

Edit - the pouch badge would fit French Grenadiers of the line (although the pattern of the pouch was changed from that shown to one with a combined frog in 1813).
I'll check re. Imperial Guard.

[grenadierguardsman]

Originally Posted by leigh kitchen

You mean as a design or device on the shako plate rather than as the star "shape" itself as the plate?

Yes Leigh on the plate.
Andy

[grenadierguardsman]

Seen here Leigh.
Andy

[leigh kitchen]

Yes, ta, I was unsure as to whether you were saying the plates were of that pattern or a star-shaped pattern.

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman

Seen here Leigh.
Andy

Isn't that the 1st Foot Guards plate pre-Waterloo, Andy? The cypher and garter strap would suggest that. All Foot Guards had cap stars until the Grenade Fired Proper was adopted by the 1st after Waterloo.

[Alex Rice]

As usual, the knowledge on the forum astounds me!

[grenadierguardsman]

Originally Posted by Toby Purcell

Isn't that the 1st Foot Guards plate pre-Waterloo, Andy? The cypher and garter strap would suggest that. All Foot Guards had cap stars until the Grenade Fired Proper was adopted by the 1st after Waterloo.

Toby i have info saying that this was worn at Waterloo. "Uniforms of the Foot Guards" Fosten & Carmen.
Andy

[grenadierguardsman]

The plate I've shown was worn on the False fronted "Waterloo Shako", i think the one you on about is the 1ST Stove-piped Shako. The one with the larger plate.
Andy

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman

Toby i have info saying that this was worn at Waterloo. "Uniforms of the Foot Guards" Fosten & Carmen.
Andy

Yes, I realised that, Andy, but 1st or 2nd Foot Guards? I think 1st, but you have not confirmed that and this thread is principally about the Coldstream, albeit that we have strayed. Just wish to clarify.

[grenadierguardsman]

Yes Toby 1ST, we have strayed a bit.
Andy

[grenadierguardsman]

Coldstream Guards 1880.
Andy