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  #31  
Old 31-10-17, 09:44 PM
grumpy grumpy is offline
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and thank you sir!
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  #32  
Old 31-10-17, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grumpy View Post
I have at last had leisure to look at Clothing Regs.
CR 1894 was badly drafted by somebody [or a committee] with little understanding or insight. Remember this is pre-SD, and when white drill and khakee [sic] drill was a bit under-regulated regarding badges.
"The chevrons and badges of rank for all arms of service will be worn on the right arm only***. All ....... [list of a few irrelevant SNCO/WO exceptions] chevrons and badges will be worn above the elbow.
At foot of page the asterisk *** is "A signaller, if a colour-serjeant, will wear the badge on the left arm".

I suppose we can assume that this badge is crossed signal flags, but is this upper left arm or lower? And does it matter if he is an assistant instructor?

Fast forward to CR 1914 where a 1912 Army Order is quoted.
CR gets SD etc out of the way [ranking both arms etc] and then: "In the case of other garments [eg tunic and frock, scarlet] chevrons and ranking and appointment badges will be worn on the right arm only*** and above the elbow" [with the obvious senior exceptions].
At foot of page the asterisk *** a signaller, if a colour-serjeant, will wear the signaller's badge on the left arm above the elbow. NCOs and men employed as signallers but without the assistant instructor's certificate will wear the badge on the left arm below the elbow"". Sidebar AO 275/1912.

The inference is that the C-Sjt is indeed an assistant instructor.

Having said all that, I have never ever seen a colour-serjeant so badged. Angels dancing on pinheads cannot compete.
Very interesting Grumpy, I had not spotted your reply. Thank you for posting. I too have never seen a colour sergeant with signals flags on left upper arm.
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  #33  
Old 01-11-17, 07:14 AM
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Obviously Group D trades took a big cull between 1944 and 1950.
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  #34  
Old 21-11-17, 04:08 AM
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I picked up some badges a few years ago that appeared to relate to the Artillery (a standard cap badge,etc.). The material looked to be WW1 and there may have been an OWS 1915 badge along with an SWB.

What has had me a little puzzled were two badges that were a brass wreath with a hand-cut capital letter "P" attached by two bars across the open wreath.

The other one could be a "B" but I'd not swear to this and will have to hunt them out working to the rule that a picture is better than a vague description!

Was wondering if "P" might be "PLOTTER"?
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  #35  
Old 21-11-17, 12:41 PM
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Whatever else, the P badge is not official Great War issue.
A picture would help of course.
P plotter existed from 1936, Plotter etc, but the official material was worsted.
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  #36  
Old 22-11-17, 01:19 AM
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Hi

Here are the photos of the badges. I've included the Artillery cap badge just for the purposes of scale, although they did all turn up as a "lot", hence my feelings that the "P" badges might relate to this unit.

I'm fairly sure that there was an OWS 1915 badge and something else that grabbed my attention at the time, making these just a bit of an "extra".

I sincerely doubt that they are hugely valuable and probably more of a "curio" than anything. The "P" appears to be a "one-off" and you can see that they don't even match.

Thoughts?
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File Type: jpg tradebadge 003.jpg (31.3 KB, 33 views)
File Type: jpg tradebadge 002.jpg (30.9 KB, 17 views)
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  #37  
Old 22-11-17, 09:53 AM
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My opinion, for what little it is worth, is that the P badges were indeed RA Plotter, period WW II, crafted in the unit workshops.
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  #38  
Old 23-11-17, 01:30 AM
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Hi

Many thanks for that. So I was right about the "PLOTTER" bit, but just got the wrong period?

Possible therefore that the "owner" was a WW1 veteran who had postwar service?

I can't swear that there wasn't an SWB also with this lot and that it wasn't an Artillery man. Like as not, I would have not made the "link" and put the cap badges, etc. in one place and the SWB in another.

Either that or it was just a bit of a "grab bag" lot of badges that ended up on eBay....
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  #39  
Old 30-08-21, 05:36 PM
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Whilst we are on this i may as well ask.
A Guards CSM has a pair of cross swords on his rank badge . Is he a AIPTI or Swordsmanship Instructor ? Does he actually have to do the course,or is he given it as a rank privilige as a Sgt would get an arm badge ?
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  #40  
Old 30-08-21, 06:46 PM
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Default Grenadier Guards

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Originally Posted by Mike H View Post
Whilst we are on this i may as well ask.
A Guards CSM has a pair of cross swords on his rank badge . Is he a AIPTI or Swordsmanship Instructor ? Does he actually have to do the course,or is he given it as a rank privilige as a Sgt would get an arm badge ?

In certain orders of dress the crossed swords form part of the badges of rank of the Grenadier Guards.

Here is a WO2 Drum Major and the badges of a Colour Sergeant.

Tim
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  #41  
Old 30-08-21, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grey_green_acorn View Post
In certain orders of dress the crossed swords form part of the badges of rank of the Grenadier Guards.

Here is a WO2 Drum Major and the badges of a Colour Sergeant.

Tim
Thats exactly the thing i meant but which trade do they represent ?
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  #42  
Old 30-08-21, 07:05 PM
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None, it is a traditional part of the rank badges worn by Grenadier Guards Colour Sergeants and Warrant Officers Class 2.

Perhaps the former Grenadier Guardsmen on the Forum can explain why it is worn?

Tim
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Last edited by grey_green_acorn; 30-08-21 at 07:22 PM.
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  #43  
Old 30-08-21, 07:07 PM
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Deleted.

Marc
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I am still looking for British Army cloth Formation, Regimental, Battalion, Company and other Unit sleeve badges, from 1980 onwards.

Last edited by 54Bty; 30-08-21 at 07:09 PM. Reason: Same answer
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