Royal Canadian Dragoons cap badges

[cdndragoon]

Hi everyone - long term collector, first time poster.

I've taken some photos of some of my more interesting cap badges and I'm hoping to get some input on the earlier ones.

The Edward VII badge has clearly been welded together from two separate pieces and is bimetal, which doesn't match what is listed in my copy of Mazeas. I've checked in the Regimental archives, and they have seen only one other badge of the type (although the fact the Archives has one is a vote of confidence in my mind).

The George V badge is similarly welded but is all old brass. This one would be of particular interest because the Regiment switched to the springbok very early in George V's reign - I've never seen another royal cypher from this era.

The officer's gilt springbok is included for a point of comparison with the last one, a custom made NCM badge that my Sqn had made on tour in 2009. We sent some 105mm casings (lethal shots fired in anger) back to Kandahar airfield and our SQMS 'knew a guy' who stamped them into badges for every soldier in the Sqn. A keepsake for me, and a nice conversation piece for the collection.

I noticed that the projects from the top of the page are missing two of the badges I have above as well as a Victorian RCR helmet plate - I'd be happy to provide higher quality photos of all, if theyd be of interest.

So, in closing, if there are any folks with info on the older two badges, I'd be happy to hear from you.


Thanks!

cdndragoon

[Tanker Mike]

Very interesting that you had cap badges made from spent shell casings, amazing what the locals could make. Were they made from a die stamp?

I watched a show that showed in Pakistan somewhere up in the mountains a town makes weapons from scratch, anything you need from an AK to a DSHK. All made by hand with grinding wheels and elbow grease, amazing.

Mike

[Phillip Herring]

I thought that the Petawawa Base Museum had a framed display of RCD badges courtesy of John Gardam. Is it still there?

Phil

[Bill A]

A thought about the cypher badges. Is it possible/likely that Scully took a "generic" royal cypher and added the RCD scroll? There are cypher badges worn by other regiments, eg the RCR shoulder cyphers which may have been modified by the addition of the scroll.
Images of the missing badges are welcome. Please contact me.

[cdndragoon]

Mike - yes, the badges were die stamped - I've attached a photo of the reverse to show how that side looks.

While I was over there, one of the locals was very enthusiastic to show me the knock-off MP5 he had made in one of the cottage-industry workshops. It seemed to function pretty well, but it did look a bit odd with the rainbow-pattern shoulderstrap he was equally excited about!

Cheers!

[cdndragoon]

Bill - I had the same thought about the RCR cypher and the scroll.

I considered the idea that either Scully or, in a pinch, the Regiment, would take an old scroll and weld it onto a new cypher in order to be able to produce them quickly enough. I didn't think it likely that a soldier would snap the old cypher off and weld a new one on - but I've seen stranger things!

I'll PM with higher resolution photos of the other badges.

Cheers!

[John S.]

cdndragoon:
It appears to me that both your EVII and GVR RCD hat badges are put together pieces.
Your EVII badge is different from the one in my collection, as mine is:
a one piece striking, slightly curved, with smooth backing, having three lugs located E/W on the ends of the motto, and behind the crown.
I have never seen/heard of a GVR RCD badge such as yours, but agree with others that both your EVII and GVR patterns appear to be using the authorized RCR pattern shoulder badges, in the construction of these badges.
In addition, both of your badges appear to have had the mottos of legitimate RCD springbok badges snipped and substituted with the EVII and GVR cyphers, I would guess.
Sorry to bring potentially bad news, but that is my opinion.
On another front, your Afganistan made RCD springbok- is it the brass looking springbok, or is it the gilt finished badge? If gilt, I am most impressed, but if not, the brass looking badge looks high quality too.
Cheers,
John S.

[cdndragoon]

John S. - I definitely have my own doubts as to their authenticity, given the cutting and pasting they went through in order to come together.

Regardless of how they look now, the silvered scroll is notable, since we never had a silvered-type badge. It was always brass or gilt in the old days. Even with a cypher taken off another badge (RCR perhaps?) I'm not sure where the scroll would have come from.

I appreciate the opinions (yours and others), especially given the breadth of experience everyone here has. If it's a fake, so be it, but I enjoy the hunt regardless.

The custom badge the Sqn had made in Afghanistan was the NCM brass one and I'm very impressed with the level of detail that came out in the die stamping. Perhaps because it was a very limited quantity (less than 150 badges made from three casings), but the detail looked great.

Thanks again,

cdndragoon

[cdndragoon]

Originally Posted by Phillip Herring

I thought that the Petawawa Base Museum had a framed display of RCD badges courtesy of John Gardam. Is it still there?

Phil - the display has been taken down, as far as I can recall. There were a number of badges that had gotten broken or simply pilfered from the display. The archives actually came by my office to see if I could help them figure out what was missing (WWI greatcoat collar dogs, buttons, etc) but at least a half a dozen items had either fallen off the display or been taken.

The museum displays have been reworked completely over the past few years and look pretty good for now, but the best stuff always tends to be behind closed doors. I'm happy I'm able to pop over and pick through their stacks when time permits.

Cheers,

cdndragoon

[John S.]

cdndragoon:
Would love to see the reverse of the Afghan manufactured badge, if possible.
Cheers,
John S.

[cdndragoon]

John S - my post #5 above is the reverse of the Afghan manufactured badge.

As you can see in the picture, it's a very thin slice of brass that was used, but it shows the level of detail that the manufacturer was able to get with such a deep stamping.

As I mentioned, I think the limited run meant that the die was still very sharply marked for all the badges that were made. I'm not sure if it's unique enough to be differentiated from other NCM badges on visual inspection if someone were to come across another one.

Cheers!

cdndragoon

[John S.]

cdndragoon:
Amazing quality in that Afghan made badge!
I sure hope they don`t get it into their minds to start making repros of all the older Canadian militia badges and CEF stuff. If they do, we will all will be in for a lot of grief!!
Cheers,
John S.

[Young Law]

Apologies in resurrecting an old thread, but reference the cyphered badges Appendix 1 of the 1907 Dress Regulations state:

[On Puggaree and Cloth Forage Cap] "In gilt or gilding metal, the Royal Cypher and Crown, a below inscribed "Royal Canadian, Dragoons."

[CanadianBrad]

Hello All,

Sorry for resurrecting an old thread, but this fits with what I wanted to post, so here we are.

Mail Call was good to me yesterday as I received an EviiR cap badge to the RCD. It doesn't have any markings on the back however it is one solid make and not frankensteined together.

As well, earlier last month I received 2 Springbok badges that I could use some assistance with ID'ing the time period worn. I am assuming the first one was Pre-WWI to WWI period. The second I feel might be post WWI going on to WW2. It has Scully Ltd Montreal marked on the reverse side of it.

If anyone has any other insight into these I would appreciate it!

Cheers

Brad

[IMG][/IMG]

[CanadianBrad]

Wait one,

Sorting out my life with these pictures. Will have them posted soon!