Metropolitan Police Question.......

[QSAMIKE]

Good Evening Everyone......

I am doing some research on a family of members of the Metropolitan Police with over 100 years of service (Father, 3 Sons, 1 Grandson)......

I have a number of their medals and service documents and they mention a "Warrant Number" in a way I guess it is a form of Serial Number.....

The question is..... The number that was worn on the collar of the old uniforms and on the shoulders of modern uniforms...... Are they part of the Warrant Number, i.e. the last 3 digits for example as the full number is quite long.....

Thanks in advance.....

Mike

[altcar73]

The collar/shoulder number is NOT the warrant number, which is one issued to the individual at the start of service and remains with him/her until retirement. It is not re-issued and is unique to the individual. The collar number is issued on a divisional basis and changes when the officer moves to another division.

Dave.

[QSAMIKE]

Thanks Dave......

I was thinking of getting the last three numbers of their Warrant numbers to mount with the medals...... All I have to do is to get the rank badges now..... They range in rank from Sergeant to Chief Constable......

Mike

[johnG]

Hi Mike,
As one with family which includes those who have served in the Metropolitan Police, City of London Police, Palestine Police, Royal Hong Kong Police, and my stints with the British South Africa Police Reserve, you have given me a new collecting idea. Many thanks.

My Metropolitan Police man was my grandfather (born 1886), a sergeant stationed at Staines, Middlesex, when he died at an early age in 1913, the Met's boundaries being more extensive in those days than they are now.

Good luck with your collection.

Regards,

John

[altcar73]

Originally Posted by QSAMIKE

Thanks Dave......

I was thinking of getting the last three numbers of their Warrant numbers to mount with the medals...... All I have to do is to get the rank badges now..... They range in rank from Sergeant to Chief Constable......

Mike

Mike,

The badges of rank have changed over the years and were not as they are to-day. To be sure of exactly what design of badge was worn you will need to pin down the exact dates during which the particular rank was held. For example, the rank of Chief Constable in the London Metpol. ceased to exist many years ago as did several other ranks (Station Inspector, Divisional Inspector, Sub-Divisional Inspector). Also, the design of the rank stars and bars which were worn are all but impossible to find now.

Dave.

[BWEF]

Mike

There is also the "Metropolitan Police Heritage Centre", where there might be further information on the family you are researching.

It's worth a try anyway as it is free!

https://www.metpolicehistory.co.uk/m...ge-centre.html

[QSAMIKE]

Thank You Gentlemen......

For all your assistance and contact, I have sent them an email.....

Here are the men I am looking into:

Father Thomas Worth - P.C. to Superintendent - 1869 to 1897 recall for Victoria's Funeral and 1902 Coronation - Warrant Number 57675

1st Son Thomas Vincent Worth - P.C. to Police Sergeant - 1908 to 1926 - Discharged to pension due to wounds received while on duty - Warrant Number 95923

2nd Son Leonard Raymond Worth - P.C. to Clerk/Records Sergeant - 1904 to 1930 - Discharged to Pension - Warrant Number 90703

3rd Son Percy Edgar Worth - P.C. to Detective Chief Constable CID - 1910 to 1947 - Awarded MBE - Discharged to Pension - Warrant Number 98954

I have not confirmed it yet but there might have been one more a son of Percy Edgar Worth who was also a Policeman......

Thanks again.....

Mike

[Fatherofthree]

Greetings Mike and good whatever time of day it is.
Warrant numbers, 163464, that was me and I suppose, just like Army numbers, never forgotten.
A fantastic family association in the Met when Cops were cops and villains were scared; unfortunately today's police have completely abrogated the legacy those old timers left.

Don’t get me going on this subject.

Try this: National Association of Retired Police Officers, (NARPO).
It may hold some records/details of you family, but if not you can always drop them a line asking for information. They may also publish the request in the quarterly magazine asking if anybody has any knowledge/information.
Contact details: NARPO House, 38, Bond Street, Wakefield, West Yorkshire, WF1 2QP.
Email: hqnarpo.org.
Tel: 01924 362166
Also try London Police Pensioner, (LPP), which is the Met. Branch of NARPO.
Contact details: Judy Redford, NARPO, 9th Floor, Empress State Building, Lillie Road, London, SW6 1TR.
Email: admin@londonnarpo.org.uk.
Tel: 0203 151 1212.
LPP may also publish the request.
In respect of Thomas Vincent, they may also be able to discover the facts surrounding his wounding.
I wish you well in your endeavour, you never know, there are still some old timers out there who may have served at the same time as Percy towards the end of his service.
Example, my dad joined in 1949, (I think) and is still alive and gardening.
A minor point; Detective Chief Constable wasn’t a rank as far as I know; he was probably a Detective Chief Inspector………..in those days, almost Godlike.
Regards.
Brian

[QSAMIKE]

Originally Posted by Fatherofthree

A minor point; Detective Chief Constable wasn’t a rank as far as I know; he was probably a Detective Chief Inspector………..in those days, almost Godlike.
Regards.
Brian

Good Evening Brian......

Thank you very much about the contacts..... I have a number of leads now that will really help, and a lot of work that I am looking forward to doing.....

I have a copy of a list of members, rank and position and he was called Detective Chief Constable CID, I understand that the title was changed to Detective Chief Superintendent in 1945 (the Director of the Metropolitan Police had 5 Chief Constables for head of each of the department under his command at the time).....

Mike

Oh yes..... My mother who during WW2 worked at Bletchly Park and also did 28 years service with the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.....

[altcar73]

Originally Posted by QSAMIKE

Good Evening Brian......

Thank you very much about the contacts..... I have a number of leads now that will really help, and a lot of work that I am looking forward to doing.....

I have a copy of a list of members, rank and position and he was called Detective Chief Constable CID, I understand that the title was changed to Detective Chief Superintendent in 1945 (the Director of the Metropolitan Police had 5 Chief Constables for head of each of the department under his command at the time).....

Mike

Oh yes..... My mother who during WW2 worked at Bletchly Park and also did 28 years service with the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.....

Mike,

The rank of "Chief Constable" in the Metropolitan Police was actually re-designated to "Commander"in 1946, a rank which continues in existence to-day. The rank of Deputy Commander was also used for a short period.

Dave.

[Fatherofthree]

Re Detective Chief Constable: I stand, (or sit) corrected.

Something learnt every day.

Commander or DCS in those days even more God like.

Mike I wish you well with your research.

Regards.
Brian

[badjez]

Many years ago I made enquiry of the Met personnel office regarding a PC who had joined the SAS. I was told that all personnel records were destroyed seven years after the officer left The Job. However, about a year later an A3 envelope arrived, without any explanation or return address which contained my man's full record!

The moral of the story is don't take the Met's first answer as being gospel if they deny knowing anything (after all, they are well known for denying involvement in many dodgy activities!).

Additionally, some of the Met Police Routine Orders have been deposited at the National Archives, Kew. With luck you could find the exact dates of service of your relatives from them

Stephen.