Old Dorset Regt ?

[Diehard]

Hi All,

Need help with this one. Is it something to do with Dorset Regt? Or maybe the militia ?

Thanks

Will

[Mike]

Yes, a common recurring pattern for Rifle Volunteer Corps Shako badge, a crowned Bugle horn. The 39th Foot as you say being the predecessor of the Dorsetshire Regiment.
So my best guess is it is, or is pretending to be, a Dorsetshire Rifle Volunteer Corps Shako badge, although this is a calculated guess, as I have no reference to that particular badge.

But.... there seems to be a lot of different bugle horn type Victorian badges of various units real or invented appearing for sale at the moment?? all copies I assume, these things should be hens teeth?

Hello Will - There is rarely any link between the RVC number and the Line Regiment number. It is much more likely that your badge is of a County which had 39 (or more) Corps - like Middlesex, for example. Research in the National Army Museum archive may well come up with photographs or other illustrations depicting your shako plate - although it could be an early glengarry badge. Happy hunting. David

[Mike]

yes scrap that - no connection to regular foot regiment number.
Kipling and king do illustrate your type but a "36" variety* to the "36th West Yorkshire Rifle Volunteer Corps." (later 2nd Vol Btn The York and Lancaster Regiment)

K&K do say there are just to many of these early RVCs badges to have been included in their book, so they just have a sprinkling to illustrate the variety.

do you think yours is an original?? if so would love to see the back.

* KK1520

[Mike]

Just to make life more difficult in identifying with regards to that number: quote Kipling and King "Headdress badges of the British army"

"
As Rifle Corps, pouch-belts were widely worn and, in some instances, the badge was worn on the pouch-belt and not on the head-dress. This explains why some units do not appear to have a cap-badge.
Badges, too, often incorporated the bugle-horn which is associated with all Rifle Corps and the simplest form of badge was just the bugle-horn, with or without the crown, and with a number in the curl.
The number can be confusing for sometimes it was the precedence number of the County and, sometimes, the precedence number alloted by the County to the Corps. Gloucestershire is an interesting example. The County precedence number was 20 and that appears on the badges of several of the Gloucestershire Rifle Volunteer Corps, but the Corps numbered only sixteen in all. "

[Mike]

so I guess from that it's a process of elimination.

find out which county was allocated "39" and see if they had a generic "39" badge or not, and find what counties had a "39th" RVC.

worst case senario is that there is a generic "39" plus a few "39th" RVCs so you will have find descriptions/photos of each.

[Diehard]

Thanks Lads for taking a look. Heres a picture of the back.

Hope this is clear enough, I was trying to show the loops.

I got this item off a reliable source. I would welcolme any comments.

[Mike]

Thanks. Looks like blackened finish at one time, which is common for Rifle Corps units.

[Gurkha]

Hi Will, found time to consult my copy of 'directory of Rifle vol, by Ray Westlake. the following counties had RV corps numbered '39' so take your pick.

Kent.
39th, Malling, formed June 1860, to 2nd Admin batt, then 3rd admin batt 1861. Moved to West malling 1862 disbanded 1874

Lanarkshire39th, Glasgow formed dec 1859 from employees of shipping companies, became No 7 company 1st Lanarkshire RV Feb 1860.

Lancashire.39th, Liverpool, formed Feb 1860, and attached to 2nd admin batt, known as 'Liverpool welsh'. Became part of 5th Lancs RV 1st Dec 1862.

Middlesex.
39th, Formed Clerkenwell Mar 1860, attached 3rd Admin batt until 1861, 'Finsbury Rifle Vol Corp' added to title in 1862, renumbered to 21st in 1880.

Staffordshire
39th Staff Rif Vol, Burton On trent, formed sept 1860, attached 2nd Admin batt. ame H Company 5th Staffordshire RV in 1880.

Yorkshire39th , Bingley, formed April 18 1861, moved to saltaire 1871, disbanded 1875.

maybe a call to regt musuem's may help as this has narrowed it down a bit.
Steve

[Diehard]

Steve,

Thanks mate, I thought it might be difficult to get to the bottom of this one.

The infos great it gives me a start. I had the middx, lancs and yorks on my list, but I didn't know about the others.

I've also got the county precedence numbers to contend with

Cheers,
Will

[Gurkha]

Try these first, you may well find that as these units were small, they could possibly have worn the same badge if this was ready made. I think your badge is nearer 1860's than later.
Good luck.
Steve

[Diehard]

Hi All,

I think I've got to the bottom of the mystery. Just got hold of a copy of "Badges of the Worcestershire Reigiment" by R.W.Bennett., and page 69 has a pick of this badge in silver(for officers), which is very similar to mine. Date of wear 1859-1900.

It states -"in 1859 the volunteers were re-formed. The officers forage cap badge was basically a bugle surrounding the county precedence number '39'.Two types exist, a stringed bugle and a curled bugle."

Although mine is blackened brass it does say later in the book examples of pouch badges were brass and were probably blackened.

So hopefully I've found the answer. Could any Worcestershire collectors confirm this.

Thanks again,

Will

PS. If anyone is interested in the Worcestershire Regt, I highly recommend this book. If only every Regt had such a detailed tome on its insignia

[wright241]

Originally Posted by Diehard

Hi All,

Need help with this one. Is it something to do with Dorset Regt? Or maybe the militia ?

Thanks

Will

Apparently the numbering of RV changed a lot - and renumbering from a low to a high caused a lot of resentment - but lots of badges....
Difficult one this as copies abound as well. Good luck.

[Diehard]

Thanks to Blizzard !

Its probably a 39th Worcestershire RV badge, who were based in Kidderminster. Later becoming the 7th Bn Worcestershre Regiment.

Cheers All

Will