Victorian crowns?

[Martyn123]

Good afternoon.

Sorting through my unsorted buttons I have found a few buttons that I'm having trouble with in that I can't make my mind up about the crown type.

The Royal naval buttons appear to be Victorian by design with the lined background being pre 1891 I think but not sure about the crowns. They also have steel backs. The smaller one is of an unusual design. The Berkshire regiment button has a plain brass back.

Are these Victorian or later

Many thanks

Martyn

[manchesters]

All Queen Victoria Crown buttons.

regards

[Martyn123]

Many thanks Simon sometimes find it difficult to tell modern crown from Vicky.

Regards

Martyn

[btns]

I think only button 1 is a uniform button. IMHO the other buttons have been made for the fashion industry.

[Martyn123]

Many thanks for the info

Regards

Martyn

[Martyn123]

Good evening

Do you think that these naval buttons are costume rather than uniform. I think that the smaller one is as it has a different design to the standard pattern but I've seen Victorian general service buttons with steel back with the central depression and lose loop? Opinions please.

Many thanks

Regards

Martyn

[Peter Brydon]

Originally Posted by Martyn123

............ sometimes find it difficult to tell modern crown from Vicky.

Regards

Martyn

Martyn,

An author of one of the first badge books that I ever came across had the same problem.

Peter

[Peter Brydon]

Sorry Duplicate post.

P.B.

[Martyn123]

Many thanks Peter. Some crowns are East to tell apart on some items but on others I think it can be quite difficult. The St Edwards crown can sometimes look like the Victorian. What do you think about these naval buttons. The one does look like a costume type but the other two look like some Victorian general service types in construction. Some Victorian Smith & Wright types use steel backs of the same design. All of my other Victorian naval buttons have backmarks, but then again I have some Victorian general service without backmarks.

Many thanks

Martyn

[btns]

You have a lot buttons and a lot of questions, but it seems you are short of knowledge.
May I politely request your intentions?

If you plan to sell your objects, you should mention this in your first message.
Some members are not willing to spend their time helping you sell your objects.
Other members do not mind.

With regards to steel backs:
- steel backs on buttons for other ranks infantry: dust does not damage them. Rain is OK as well.
- steel backs on buttons for Naval Officers: salt water will corrode them immediately.
Other ranks uniforms are issued to them. Naval Officers pay for their uniforms themselves. Tailors will tell them what to put on their uniforms.

regards,

[Martyn123]

Many thanks for your reply

No I have no intension of selling the buttons. I am a keen collector who is trying to sort out my collection. I have all sorts of items including uniforms, medals, badges and deactivated firearms.

I realise that salt will corrode steel as I have in the navy but I just wanted to check as they may have been treated with some coating or may have been worn by shore based officers. I do not specialise in buttons but have an interest in all historical items having also worked in a museum.

Regards

Martyn

[Martyn123]

Good evening

I was interested in the steel back naval buttons and the possibility that they are Victorian naval issue so wrote to the National Martine Museum with pictures. To my surprise they answered and to my surprise they have some on an officer's uniform jacket of circa 1880. They were produced to reduce the costs of uniforms and production by a variety of manufacturers including Smith and Wright of Birmingham. They were chemically treated or painted to reduce the effects of sea air. Steel backed buttons were also produced for the confederate navy in America.

Regards

Martyn