SCOTTISH LOVAT SCOUTS 51st HIGHLAND VOLS ANODISED BADGE

[hagwalther]

Hi Guys,

On eBay at:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWNX:IT

are some Lovat Scouts A/A badges.

These are quite expensive but there is more to this particular item that makes them attractive to a collection.

1) They are early examples using the same lugs shared with Smith and Wright.

2) They are maker marked FIRMIN.

3) They come in original tissue with yellowing sellotape beoing pre Firmins individual plastic packaging.

As such, one can reconcile maker to lugs and the early A/A packaging used by this manufacturer.

A collection needs two as this is still a current issue item.

Please note that I have no relationship with this dealer whatsoever.

Regards

Chris

[William]

Many thanks for the good tip Chris!

I just got home to find one of these delivered while I've been away.

Is it OK if I boast that I now have three different AA Lovat Scouts in my collection?

[hagwalther]

Originally Posted by William

Many thanks for the good tip Chris!

I just got home to find one of these delivered while I've been away.

Is it OK if I boast that I now have three different AA Lovat Scouts in my collection?

Hi William,

The badge on the right is certainly different but for the left and center badge while the reverse die is different the obverse looks the same - is it?

Do all three badges have the same lugs?

Regards

Chris

[William]

Originally Posted by hagwalther

Hi William,

The badge on the right is certainly different but for the left and center badge while the reverse die is different the obverse looks the same - is it?

Do all three badges have the same lugs?

Regards

Chris

Thanks for the questions Chris,

All three badges appear to have identical lug fittings on the back.

The badge marked 'Firmin' is a thinner, marginally less substantial construction than the other two. The front is also more even and smooth, with less relief across it, particularly on the stag's head, which is almost flat.
The neck of the stag on the Firmin is narrower than on the other two badges.

Of the other two badges, they both have more relief overall and both stag's heads are built slightly more sturdily. The seeding on both scrolls is finer than on the Firmin badge.

The lettering on one is almost, though not exactly, identical to the Firmin, whilst on the other the lettering is more blocked and the spacing is somewhat different.

To the non-collector, these three badges probably appear identical, but on close inspection there are a number of clear differences in design and some slight differences in construction.

Best rgds

[hagwalther]

Originally Posted by William

Thanks for the questions Chris,

All three badges appear to have identical lug fittings on the back.

The badge marked 'Firmin' is a thinner, marginally less substantial construction than the other two. The front is also more even and smooth, with less relief across it, particularly on the stag's head, which is almost flat.
The neck of the stag on the Firmin is narrower than on the other two badges.

Of the other two badges, they both have more relief overall and both stag's heads are built slightly more sturdily. The seeding on both scrolls is finer than on the Firmin badge.

The lettering on one is almost, though not exactly, identical to the Firmin, whilst on the other the lettering is more blocked and the spacing is somewhat different.

To the non-collector, these three badges probably appear identical, but on close inspection there are a number of clear differences in design and some slight differences in construction.

Best rgds

Hi William,

So if the lugs are all the same the badges could have been made by the same company. (There is an issue with this statements as both Smith and Wright and Firmin shared these lugs). If though, they did come from the same company it follows (from the information you have supplied) that different dies were used.

Why would this be?

The immediate possibilities are:

damage to original
loss of original

However, there is a third possibility and you note the thickness of the material used - what is this third possibility and why is it important to the collector?

Regards

Chris

[William]

Originally Posted by hagwalther

What is this third possibility and why is it important to the collector?

I assume you allude to the possibility that at least one of the trio cd be a badge produced expressly for the collector's market?

[hagwalther]

Originally Posted by William

I assume you allude to the possibility that at least one of the trio cd be a badge produced expressly for the collector's market?

Hi William,

Nope - they are all official issue but the difference between then basically is that one is thinner than the others. This I believe also relates to the time of manufacture and the price of aluminium, exchange rate between $US and GBP aluminium was (is) sold in $US, cost of manufacture (especially power) to further refine the aluminium to 'super purity' state as used in A/A badges.

During the 1970's to the 1980's all these rose quite dramatically and as such the thinner badge was probably made after the thicker one as it was cheaper to make.

Rule of thumb for Scottish badges (and probably all) especially the larger ones - the thicker the badge the older it is. I cover all this in my Scottish Badges chapter with plenty of references to back up my arguments including cost of re cutting new dies to accommodate the thinner aluminium sheet metal.

What the collector needs to check is that if a unit completed service in the 1960's or before AND the badge is of very thin aluminium sheet with lots of reverse detail then it is probably an unofficial commission.

Again, I must reiterate - this is not absolute but nevertheless a good rule to follow.

Regards

Chris

[Alan O]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1423595435...torefresh=true

Not cheap at over £60.

[ukbrits]

Hi Gents,
Just for collectors interest this badge has also been worn by Orkney Independent Cadet Battery A.C.F in A/A.
Hope this may be useful info for someone!
Regards
Colin