7th Gurkha Rifles: badge and titles

[loupie1961]

A small lot of 7th Gurkha Rifles insignia. A pughri badge, metal shoulder titles, embroidered white over black cloth arc title. I am wondering when such a title could have been introduced, since a BD blouse in my collection sports arc titles embroidered in black over rifle green cloth. Any hints?

[54Bty]

White on black, 7th Gurkha Rifles. Catalogue number CB 2680, pattern number 16109, sealed 25th March 1953, introduced 12th June 1954, C6141 August 1954.

Marc

Sorry, I miss read the List of Change and the above information is for 'White on Rifle Green'.

I have also checked my designation and in bad light it does look to be black, it is in fact a very dark Rifle Green.

Marc

[loupie1961]

Originally Posted by 54Bty

White on black, 7th Gurkha Rifles. Catalogue number CB 2680, pattern number 16109, sealed 25th March 1953, introduced 12th June 1954, C6141 August 1954.

Marc

thank you Marc! what about Black on Rifle Green?

[Postwarden]

On 6th December 1951 the War Office Dress Committee approved Titles, Arm, Embroidered for Gurkha battle dress; KRRC red on Rifle Green for 2nd Gurkha Rifles, black on Rifle Green for 6th, 7th and 10th Gurkha Rifles as their dress conformed to that of the Rifle Brigade.

On 26th November 1952 the WODC approved a change of colours for 7th’s title which, on the personal initiative of Field-Marshal Bill Slim the 7th’s Regimental Colonel, were changed to the Indian Army-style of white on Rifle Green as he thought the black on green title was ‘illegible at any distance’ and thus served no purpose. The green and white title was approved by the WODC on 16th January 1953 and notified as LofC Change 6141 on 31st August 1954.

With the approval of Field-Marshal Slim and the new regimental Colonel, Field-Marshal Templer, in February 1957 the Brigade’s London Liaison Officer asked to revert to black on green titles, as the earlier change had been made without consulting the two Commanding Officers.

jon

[gurkharifles]

Hi Loupie

A nice little lot - if they came from one uniform/source then you could date it almost to the year. The badge with the original backing ( very nice ) was in use by all ranks of the second battalion from around 1920 > 1946 and thereafter by both battalions until 1952. The metal shoulder titles ( with GR ) were in use from 1950 > 1994 and the cloth shoulder was worn by officers from 1953 > 1961. So my guess if they all came from the same officer would be 2nd Battalion , early 1953. Tim

[loupie1961]

Originally Posted by gurkharifles

Hi Loupie

A nice little lot - if they came from one uniform/source then you could date it almost to the year. The badge with the original backing ( very nice ) was in use by all ranks of the second battalion from around 1920 > 1946 and thereafter by both battalions until 1952. The metal shoulder titles ( with GR ) were in use from 1950 > 1994 and the cloth shoulder was worn by officers from 1953 > 1961. So my guess if they all came from the same officer would be 2nd Battalion , early 1953. Tim

hello Tim, no, they haven't got the same provenience: were all purchase separately, the metal titles in a lot comprehensive of bakelite black buttons

[loupie1961]

Originally Posted by 54Bty

White on black, 7th Gurkha Rifles. Catalogue number CB 2680, pattern number 16109, sealed 25th March 1953, introduced 12th June 1954, C6141 August 1954.

Marc

Sorry, I miss read the List of Change and the above information is for 'White on Rifle Green'.

I have also checked my designation and in bad light it does look to be black, it is in fact a very dark Rifle Green.

Marc

I will have to check it out once again (AND in good light) but the arc title seemed to be rather black than a very dark green...

[Carnforth]

I'd be grateful for any information on additional/alternate insignia worn by 7GR during the time they were converted to artillery.
Thanks

[54Bty]

Originally Posted by Carnforth

I'd be grateful for any information on additional/alternate insignia worn by 7GR during the time they were converted to artillery.
Thanks

Malayan Emergency.

As part of a plan to create an all-arms Gurkha division, the two battalions began retraining to become field artillery regiments. The experiment was short-lived because almost at once the Regiment was committed to the campaign against communist insurgents which came to be known as the Malayan Emergency and reverted to its infantry role.

Marc

[gurkharifles]

As far as I'm aware there were no different insignia worn by the regiment during this brief period. Tim

[Gurkha]

Agree with Tim,
No badges other than the normal 7th ones were worn in the short period they were training as gunners.

Steve

[Piffer]

I've seen a reference about a proposed badge design for 7GR to wear when they were converted briefly to Field Artillery. The badge it seems was never actually worn a such,for obvious reasons since their role was short lived, a collector has one ex of this prototype.

[Carnforth]

Originally Posted by 54Bty

Malayan Emergency.

As part of a plan to create an all-arms Gurkha division, the two battalions began retraining to become field artillery regiments. The experiment was short-lived because almost at once the Regiment was committed to the campaign against communist insurgents which came to be known as the Malayan Emergency and reverted to its infantry role.

Marc

Yes.
A little further information.
In May 1948 it was announced that 1/7 GR would become 101 Field Regiment Royal Artillery and 2/7 GR would become 102 Field Regiment RA, both with the suffix (7th Gurkha Rifles)
Two ex-Indian Army mountain gunners commanded the new regiments, Lt-Col James Hepper RA to 101st and Lt-Col P Cunningham to 102nd.

Several Gunner officers were also posted in. The companies were retitled P, Q, and R batteries and Gunner ranks, such as Bombardier substituted Infantry ranks.
In November 1948, both regiments were presented with RA regimental standards.

Because of the operational demands for infantry, the gunnery training was put into suspension later in the year.

Montgomery, who apparently had no strong feeling regarding Gurkhas was CIGS at the time that the decision was made that the Gurkhas would have their own artillery element. However, he was followed in that appointment by FM Slim, who as 7GR Colonel of the Regiment had made no secret that
he was determined that 7GR would cease being RA Regiments.

Return to infantry promulgated in June 1949 and the regiment and batteries were changed back to Infanty titles later that year having spent approximately 18 months designated as gunners whilst carrying out infantry operations.