Military Police KC Officers badges - advice needed

[Shiny]

Hi All,

Today I thought I'd managed to get all the military police badges I wanted for my display - until I laid them out and thought that doesn't look right.

Now I've checked my redcap collectables I've realised I should really have both versions of the officers kings crown cap badges.

My question is how common are they? Does anyone know where to find them?

I have never spotted either version which is probably how I've missed them, am I likely to find them or should I just get on framing the rest because I'll never find the missing two?

Thanks for the help,

Michael

[engr9266]

I have the following CMP/RMP versions - GVR chromed, GV1R chromed & a GV1R sliver plated but I believe only the GV1R was officer or possibly Warrant officer. Not sure this helps?
Jerry

[Shiny]

Thanks Jerry,

I take it they were just picked up over time?

Michael

[badjez]

Info gleaned from WO 359/19. Ordnance Records of Change. 1932-39.

07.02.47. Officers seconded to RMP will wear Silver plate RMP badges henceforth. (Previously officers wore their own regimental badges.). TA officers will be commissioned into RMP.

Also
16.06.48. ACI 529:
1. Approval has been given for the adoption of new designs of badges detailed below for the RMP.
2. Cap and collar badges.
(a) Officers- Within a laurel wreath, the Royal Cypher with crown above. Beneath, a scroll inscribed ‘Royal Military Police’.
(b) Other ranks- Design as for officers but in gilding metal.
The collar badges for both officers and other ranks are in reduced size.
3. (a) Officers- When supplies become available…
1. (b) Other ranks-[Issues will be made as and when they become available, existing badges will be replaced on a scale of one for each other rank. Demands will not be submitted…]
4. No change is being made in the authorised pattern of regimental buttons (The Royal Cypher and Crown)

26.03.49. ACI 277: Ref ACI 529 of 1948, supplies of new pattern cap badge now available. Old pattern to be withdrawn, declared obsolete and put up for disposal.

I've also got this extract from an earlier thread:

Since 1949, Officers serving with RMP had had the individual option of wearing RMP badges & uniforms & many in fact did.
It was not until [3rd March] 1954 that it was authorized for Officers of the Regular Army to be commissioned directly into the Corps of Royal Military Police (RMP). Up until that time, Regular Officers were attached to the CMP/RMP to serve in Provost Officer appointments (DAPM/APM etc) & retained their parent regiment cap-badges, uniforms and accoutrements etc.
Between 15 May - 28 Jul 1954, 163 Officers were gazetted as having been transferred to the RMP, all of whom were then serving with the Corps. A further 43 regular officers had transferred to RMP by 15 May 1955.

So As to officer's silver cap-badges: what I think we have is: CMP/RMP gazetted Quartermasters serving with the CMP/RMP prior to 1954, badged CMP/RMP & could have worn 'silver' cap-badges (& I have seen a silvered War Economy Measure GVIR CMP cap-badge at Bosley's) although officially they were only authorized to wear the ORs brass cap badge;. Officers serving with the Special Investigation Branch CMP/RMP generally wore General Service Corps badges (albeit they often wore any Regimental badge (British, Colonial or Commonwealth) as part of their investigative duties); post 1949, Officers in the TA & AER (& National Service) had commissioned directly into RMP so it could be posited that they wore Officers' silver cap-badges etc; & finally, as to Warrant Officer Class 1 (WO1), my research has found that the officer's pattern silver cap-badge (and collar dogs) was adopted unofficially in 1957, by WO1s, but at their own expense. The official date that is accepted as the recognized date for WO1 wearing Officers badges is: (WO Memo) WOM/BR/1019/PM1 dated 22 Aug 1961, which was then written into Corps Dress Regs, in line with other Arms & Services that 'WO Collar & Cap Badges - WOs1 are permitted to wear Officers' pattern Cap & Collar badges'.

So in sum, silver CMP/RMP GVIR cap badges would have been in circulation during his reign but probably only officially from 1949 onwards; from 1954 onwards, became standard wear for all RMP Officers; and from 1957 unofficially for WO1 and thence officially from 1961.
= = =

Hope this helps,
Stephen.

[Shiny]

Morning Stephen,

Thanks a lot for your extremely comprehensive reply, that's really interesting and helps me a lot.

In short it would appear that I do need to try and find silver Kings Crown versions of the GVIR cap badge with both the Military Police scroll and the Royal Military Police scroll although based on the replies here and a Military Police facebook group it sounds like I won't find them any time soon.

It's interesting that currently serving WO's don't seem to know anything about wearing silver / white metal cap badges. The one's I've spoken to seem to wear either the issued staybrite or brass private purchase ones they always have.

Thanks for the help everyone, the hunt goes on!

Michael

[Shiny]

Hi all,

I've managed to get what was described as a white metal GviR cap badge and I'd like to try and clean it a little. I know not everyone agrees with cleaning them but it what I want to do.

I don't want to polish it shiny but I'd like it to be obvious what it is.

I've search the forum and warm soapy water seems to be the way to go, does that sound about right or is there another option?

Michael

[fougasse1940]

Start with the soapy water. It looks plated and with anything more aggressive than that you run the risk of removing the plating.

Rgds, Thomas.

[Shiny]

Thanks a lot Thomas, I'll give that a go.

Michael