Grenadier Guards Cap badge

[grenadierguardsman]

Kipling and King reckon that the other ranks puggaree badge's, formed part of the shoulder tiles.
Andy

[2747andy]

The pattern of the OR's badges is exactly the same, with lugs they're STs with a slider they're a Pagri badge!

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by 2747andy

Nobody as far as I can see has suggested anything other than the fact that the large G&E Badges you elude to are "Officers' PAGRI badges! However the "Small" gilding metal, voided Garter strap badges with QVC are Other Ranks Pagri badges and the same badges with lugs and a KC with either GvR or GviR ciphers are the upper segment of an OTHER RANKS shoulder titles, if fitted with a long slider they are probably OTHER RANKS Pagri badges!

Andy

Makes sense to me and in line with all that I have learned working alongside Foot Guards (and associated collectors) going back many decades.

Returning to the grenade badge on the officers Wolseley pattern helmet in Leigh's photo, I saw again a very famous photo of the Queen when still Princess Elizabeth last night where she wears a civilian peaked hat with GG grenade on the front. This grenade is not bullion but in GM in the 'style' of bullion and mounted on a piece of dark blue felt. I think this type of badge is much more likely to be what is worn on the officers Wolseley FSH. Does anyone possess one of these badges and know what they are 'listed' in CRs as for?

[2747andy]

Toby,
These are often bespoke one off items presented by the Regiment to the Monarch and Royal Family! Probably locked up somewhere in Buck House!

Andy

[leigh kitchen]

Was it definitely a solid metal badge? I had to sit through the programme & commented on the badge to my wife (she always appreciates my little comments about badges & uniforms when she's trying to watch tv).
And was that civilian headgear?

[grenadierguardsman]

Originally Posted by 2747andy

The pattern of the OR's badges is exactly the same, with lugs they're STs with a slider they're a Pagri badge!

Well agree to disagree. The GV and GVI lugged pagri badges would have fitted the pagri exactly the same as a QV lugged pagri badge.
Andy

[2747andy]

Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman

Well agree to disagree. The GV and GVI lugged pagri badges would have fitted the pagri exactly the same as a QV lugged pagri badge.
Andy

Only one slight problem there!

There was not a KC lugged Pagri, only shoulder titles!

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by 2747andy

Toby,
These are often bespoke one off items presented by the Regiment to the Monarch and Royal Family! Probably locked up somewhere in Buck House!

Andy

Yes I did consider that Andy and you might be right, but the style is very reminiscent of the 'mock bullion' used by all fusilier regiment officers collar badges (and also RA) for a period and possibly by the Gren Gds too, so I am unsure.

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by leigh kitchen

Was it definitely a solid metal badge? I had to sit through the programme & commented on the badge to my wife (she always appreciates my little comments about badges & uniforms when she's trying to watch tv).
And was that civilian headgear?

I am 100% sure that it was indeed solid metal Leigh. The photo is well known and could probably be found in google images, although I have not tried. The princess is in civilian clothes and the hat looks civilian to me too, I don't think that she would have worn mixed dress. The badge was worn as a 'favour', in the way that European princesses have done for eons. http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/...96_634x651.jpg

[grenadierguardsman]

I found this today at the local market 50 pence. Metal Grenade ? Anyone ?
Andy

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman

I found this today at the local market 50 pence. Metal Grenade ? Anyone ?
Andy
]

Yes, I think so Andy and the shape of the flames appears to be the same as the grenade worn by Princess Elizabeth mentioned above. Thanks for posting.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/...96_634x651.jpg

[leigh kitchen]

Nothing to do with much, but as we're talking slidered badges & 6th Bn Grenadier Guards have cropped up, here's a photo showing the ghost of the grenade worn on the cap of a 6th Bn Grenadier killed at Salerno in 1943, probably victim of "Spandau" fire.
His badge was lugged, no sign of a slidered badge ever having been fitted.
No surprise there, but I thought I'd show the photos as there's a 6th Bn link.

[grenadierguardsman]

Originally Posted by Toby Purcell

Yes, I think so Andy and the shape of the flames appears to be the same as the grenade worn by Princess Elizabeth mentioned above. Thanks for posting.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/...96_634x651.jpg

I reckon that's going to be a Bullion Grenade.
Andy

[Toby Purcell]

Originally Posted by grenadierguardsman

I reckon that's going to be a Bullion Grenade.
Andy

There are a whole series of photos taken of Princess Elizabeth at the same session Andy, different angles etc. and some are huge. You can find them online and the resolution is excellent. Have examined them in detail and I personally saw them as gilt metal, and similar in make up to RA collar badges, but without a scroll.

Given the conditions of trench warfare only a metal badge would survive being fitted to a regularly worn steel helmet.