BRASS COLOURED SOLDER

[LONGSHANKS]

Hi all, and good morning. I wanted to ask, as I am sure I've read it here and there on different threads. The colour of the solder shown in the pics isn't a good sign - or am I wrong. A brown, I assume brass solder in place of the required gold.

Or are there good one's with this coloured braze etc.

Any input is always appreciated.

[2747andy]

Badge is fine!


Andy

[Phil2M]

Its a copper based braze as opposed to brass I believe. probably not economical to use on repro badges. Dave C, I am sure, can confirm or otherwise.

[LONGSHANKS]

Really Andy, cheers mate. I got it as part of a big bunch and accepted if it might be a fake.

But thanks for second opinion. I should keep an eye for this feature in the future. I have passed on some Scots one's with brown braze

Thanks again

Simon.

[LONGSHANKS]

Cheers Phil, was typing while you answered. Another note in my book.

Cheers both

[2747andy]

Simon,
the "Blob" die fault below the Sphinx is a good sign!

Andy

[davec2]

Hi Simon,

I am not really sure about the dark solder, it may be the mix used just oxidizes differently, thanks for your vote of confidence Phil ? ?

I do know that the fault under the tablet that the Sphinx sits on is a good sign as Andy has already expressed...I'm not sure but I think I was once told that it was a pattern from the 1930's but I could be wrong ??

Regards.

Dave.

[LONGSHANKS]

Cheers dave, even better news. I saw the die fault myself and wondered.

Thanks

Simon.

[Neibelungen]

Generally it indicates the braize has been overheated evaporating the zinc content off, leaving a much higher copper content, which will oxidise a lot more than a normal mixture.
Common on WM badges as they will take a higher heat without damage compared to a brass or gilding metal, where the metal and the braize have a narrower melting gap between them.

You can also find a similar darkening of the braize if the items has been pickled (acid dipped) for an extended period as the zinc can disolve out of the surface leaving a higher copper top layer.

[davec2]

Thanks for the info Neibelungen,

It gives me a little more of an insight to the make up of brazing mediums etc.

Dave.

[Neibelungen]

There are dozens of different braze compositions, but most are a balance of copper, with varying amounts of zinc, silver, cadmium, lead, tin and phosphorus.
Each will have different melting points and wetting qualities.

I think silver solders took over some point after the 30's when England came off the Silver Standard and the price of it dropped to make it viable and piped gas torch working became more commonplace.

I'll hunt out some engineering books of the 1900's and 20's which should give a few of the more common choices.

One interesting feature is that some brazes are suceptable to cracking in the presense of ammonia fumes, commonly found in brass cleaners, and though minimal, would explain why pins and lugs fail over extended time periods.

[Leonard D]

Interesting thread chaps, clears up some questions about the braze colour often seen on our badges.
Len.